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Author Topic:   Theistic Evolution
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8802
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 31 of 78 (46596)
07-20-2003 7:03 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by doctrbill
07-20-2003 5:19 PM


off topic! off topic! off topic! yells chicken little up to his a.. in sky.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 30 by doctrbill, posted 07-20-2003 5:19 PM doctrbill has responded

Replies to this message:
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doctrbill
Member (Idle past 382 days)
Posts: 1174
From: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Joined: 01-08-2001


Message 32 of 78 (46602)
07-20-2003 7:50 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by NosyNed
07-20-2003 7:03 PM


Nosey Ned
True to you handle aren't you.
This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 34 by NosyNed, posted 07-21-2003 3:36 AM doctrbill has responded

  
truthlover
Member (Idle past 1677 days)
Posts: 1548
From: Selmer, TN
Joined: 02-12-2003


Message 33 of 78 (46629)
07-21-2003 2:35 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by TrueCreation
01-21-2002 12:33 PM


I would be most interested to discuss with a theistic Evo,though I don't think I've located any in the forums?

I think I'm a theistic evolutionist. I didn't, and don't, think I am the only one on this board, although I can't think right now of who else is.


This message is a reply to:
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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8802
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 34 of 78 (46631)
07-21-2003 3:36 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by doctrbill
07-20-2003 7:50 PM


Re: Nosey Ned
Is that a polite "shuddup"? It seems that once a thread gets a head of steam up in the wrong direction it has to be put down.
This message is a reply to:
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Peter
Member (Idle past 1541 days)
Posts: 2160
From: Cambridgeshire, UK.
Joined: 02-05-2002


Message 35 of 78 (46638)
07-21-2003 5:23 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by doctrbill
07-19-2003 10:21 PM


quote:

And, just out of curiosity: Of what value is a god which is not sovereign and doesn't intervene?

Maybe god is just running an experiment for a science fair

...anyhow, who said a god had to be any good for anything?


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doctrbill
Member (Idle past 382 days)
Posts: 1174
From: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Joined: 01-08-2001


Message 36 of 78 (46663)
07-21-2003 10:26 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by NosyNed
07-21-2003 3:36 AM


Re: Nosey Ned
Hey Ned,

I took your suggestion seriously and then, I had just opened the new topic and returned here to see your second squawk. Seemed to me you were overly anxious and impatient to get the topic out of this thread. Check the dates and times and I think you'll see what I mean.

db


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emotional
Inactive Member


Message 37 of 78 (46705)
07-21-2003 12:49 PM


quote:
Originally posted by doctrbill:

Why not call it Deistic Evolution?


Why quibble?

quote:

You mean, without the Deity?

God's creation is a fully-gifted creation, able to self-organise. Just like an evolutionary computer simulation can run by itself once the parameters are set (by an intelligent designer), so too evolution has been running freely.

quote:

Does this mean that Deists view God as blind and ruthless?

The Deistic God is a God of Natural Law, not of caprice and miracles.

quote:

And, just out of curiosity: Of what value is a god which is not sovereign and doesn't intervene?

Ah, that loaded phrase "what value". As if God exists solely to do us favours. No, we're not talking about what is useful, we're talking about what is true. It is true that the universe is managed according to strict operation of natural law, contrary to what the Bible says.


Replies to this message:
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Minnemooseus
Member
Posts: 3586
From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior)
Joined: 11-11-2001
Member Rating: 3.9


Message 38 of 78 (59044)
10-02-2003 2:57 AM


Bump
Because of happenings in another topic, I sense it's time for a bump for this topic.

Moose


    
Flamingo Chavez
Inactive Member


Message 39 of 78 (59302)
10-03-2003 10:49 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by TrueCreation
01-21-2002 12:33 PM


--I would be most interested to discuss with a theistic Evo, though I don't think I've located any in the forums?

You rang?

------------------
"Science without religion is lame; religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein

[This message has been edited by Flamingo Chavez, 10-03-2003]


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Flamingo Chavez
Inactive Member


Message 40 of 78 (59304)
10-03-2003 11:00 PM
Reply to: Message 21 by Tranquility Base
08-19-2002 8:00 AM


Does a theistic evoltuionist really get that many browny points if he still believes God prodded things along the way? Man evolved speech not becasue of duplicated genes randomly mutating but becuase God mutated them??

What a wonderfull misunderstanding of my beliefs. Unfortunately this is the view that most people have, there is a wide spectrum of beliefs. I currently lean toward Van Till's notion of a "fully gifted creation."

------------------
"Science without religion is lame; religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstein


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Pringlesguy7
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 78 (60224)
10-09-2003 2:58 AM
Reply to: Message 33 by truthlover
07-21-2003 2:35 AM


C.S.Lewis is...was...I think, he talks about it in Mere Christianity
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crashfrog
Inactive Member


Message 42 of 78 (60348)
10-09-2003 8:32 PM
Reply to: Message 37 by emotional
07-21-2003 12:49 PM


As if God exists solely to do us favours. No, we're not talking about what is useful, we're talking about what is true.

Why would somebody believe in such a god?

I mean, if this god never intervenes nor gives any hint of its existence, why believe in god? Because you "feel" that there's a god? What?

I've never understood the faith of people like you. Maybe you can help me out. Why do you believe in god? Is there evidence? Or do you just need there to be a god? And how do you know there's not many gods?

Look into atheism. It makes a lot more sense than your belief.

It is true that the universe is managed according to strict operation of natural law

So what purpose does god serve/have? Why not just shave him away with Occam's Razor, like we do to any untestable, non-intervening, inconsequential entity?


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DBlevins
Member (Idle past 1393 days)
Posts: 652
From: Puyallup, WA.
Joined: 02-04-2003


Message 43 of 78 (60363)
10-09-2003 11:36 PM


Intellectual Laziness
Of what "use" is a Deity? I have to say that I am rather tired of this need for some supernatural entity in order for there to exist a universe or this need to explain away the evidence we see in evolution as being god directed. Science has been fighting against the supernatural explanation of nature for centuries. In this day of scientific and technological advances you would think that people would open their eyes and see the fallacies they let themselves fall into. They continue believing in some book or group of books blindly and without repeatable evidence yet refuse to see evidence presented to them which they can verify independently. They want their belief to be the correct one, and when evidence does not support it they refuse to acknowledge it or they say that their book must be infallible and any evidence that contradicts it must be wrong. It is pure intellectual laziness. It is a massive case of cognitive disonance.

[This message has been edited by DBlevins, 10-09-2003]


  
Pringlesguy7
Inactive Member


Message 44 of 78 (60455)
10-10-2003 3:46 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by crashfrog
10-09-2003 8:32 PM


hey frog

Honestly answer this one question for me. Look into the mirror, look at the ground, take a swim in the ocean, look into the sky at the stars, and think about it for a while, and honestly tell me that this was not intelligently designed (that God made it), and say that this all came to be through chance, becuase isnt that what the big bang is....just chance?

also, enlighten me on how atheism make more sens than my belief, is it becuase it takes less thought and less vulnerbility? IF you dont understand somthing, then you can just be like...well I dont believe it, so its ok

------------------
"We may ignore, but we can nowhere evade, the presence of God."


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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 Message 46 by NosyNed, posted 10-10-2003 5:44 PM Pringlesguy7 has not yet responded
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Primordial Egg
Inactive Member


Message 45 of 78 (60459)
10-10-2003 4:18 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Pringlesguy7
10-10-2003 3:46 PM


Honestly answer this one question for me. Look into the mirror, look at the ground, take a swim in the ocean, look into the sky at the stars, and think about it for a while, and honestly tell me that this was not intelligently designed (that God made it), and say that this all came to be through chance, becuase isnt that what the big bang is....just chance?

Ah....you're using the old "I can't believe this happened therefore it didn't" line of attack. An obvious question to ask here is how you discern between something that is intelligently designed and something which isn't? IOW, how do you know that natural processes couldn't produce all those warm, fuzzy, poetic things you talk of?

Incidentally, assuming you believe you're made of atoms, did you know that the process by which sub-atomic particles and (to a lesser extent) atoms and molecules behave is probabilistic ("just" chance)? There's a non-zero (although vanishingly small) probability that you could suddenly disappear into the ground. All that stops you doing that is "just" chance.

Essentially all interactions involve some element of probability.

PE


This message is a reply to:
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