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Author | Topic: Why are literalists literalists? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yes it matters, it matters tremendously, and only one of the ways it matters is that you can't have eternal truths that are presented falsely. Beyond that it matters because the literal truth of Genesis is what holds the rest of the Bible together, a whole much bigger than its parts.
But since you say you didn't want to get into this, we don't have to.
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GDR Member Posts: 6202 From: Sidney, BC, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
Does the fact that Jesus told the story of "The Good Samaritan" or "The Prodigal Son" by way of a parable in any way minimize the message that He had for them and us?
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ReverendDG Member (Idle past 4139 days) Posts: 1119 From: Topeka,kansas Joined: |
Peter Rabbit is not presented as an accounting of actual events. It is presented as a story, a tale, and everybody knows it. The Bible is presented as history and taken as history.
so is the story of how the earth was created by odin, so was the creation of the earth by eriki and EL, infact very much so like how genesis is writtenwhat about the story of the striped animals, or samson are those history? i've read flood stories that read just like genesis and seem more realisic what about gilgimesh?all of those are all real to the authors and the people who were of the religion or people they were written for if the bible is history then so are all of those, if you define things as being true because people believed them this means albino alagators live in the sewers of new york, lots of people believe this, as well as people dying from drinking pop rocks and coke! based on how you believe things you have a double standard, you believe a majority of the bible is history based on 3500 years of believers, but you don't accept anything else that way? don't you think thats a bit absurd?
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ReverendDG Member (Idle past 4139 days) Posts: 1119 From: Topeka,kansas Joined: |
Yes it matters, it matters tremendously, and only one of the ways it matters is that you can't have eternal truths that are presented falsely. Beyond that it matters because the literal truth of Genesis is what holds the rest of the Bible together, a whole much bigger than its parts.
sorry but thats just plain strange, what does genesis have to do with loving people and believing in god? why does genesis have any bearing on what jesus taught about god?so what if the authors of genesis didn't get how god created the universe, they did it from what they could understand. being that jesus grew up as a jew, you would think he would learn this story, but it doesn't say he believed it, it says he taught the story. why is it that he has to believe it for it to have meaning? he never says "i believe genesis is true!" he says something along the lines of "as you know from the torah, god created man and woman" do you think they would understand things like "god took some goo then over billions of years caused it to turn into man and woman"?or would he use stuff they know to make a point? sorry but if this is how faith has to work, i'd rather stick to nonfaith, this arguement is just weak imo
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes: Your way of reading it happens to conflict with some 3500 hundred years of majority opinion. I'll say it again, since you always ignore it: Your precious "majority opinion" also gave us the wonders of geocentrism and slavery. The "majority opinion" is conspicuously and consistently fallible. And any "majority opinion" that takes the flood myth as literal history is also notoriously wrong. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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Archer Opteryx Member (Idle past 3626 days) Posts: 1811 From: East Asia Joined: |
ReverendDG: so is the story of how the earth was created by odin, so was the creation of the earth by eriki and EL, in fact very much so like how genesis is written what about the story of the striped animals, or samson are those history? You reminded me of a famous quote:
quote: Archer All species are transitional.
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subbie Member (Idle past 1283 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
Well, what can I say? Your way of reading it happens to conflict with some 3500 hundred years of majority opinion. Hmmmmmm...... really? I'm afraid you're going to have to define what you mean by "majority opinion." Because you must not be including in your "majority" the 2/3 of the people in the world who aren't christians. You must also not be counting the single largest denomination of christianity, catholicism, which comprises more than 1/2 of all christians world wide. Certainly none of these people read every passage in the bible as being literally true. Those who would sacrifice an essential liberty for a temporary security will lose both, and deserve neither. -- Benjamin Franklin
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Brian Member (Idle past 4988 days) Posts: 4659 From: Scotland Joined: |
You'll find that Faith's opinion is the majority. She doesn't really bother with facts and figures, they often get in the way of the truth. For example, for about 3000 of the 3500 years she mentions here, no one took the Bible at face value. No Jewish scholars and no Christian church fatehrs took the Bible at face value.
Ask Faith to name a Church Father who read the Bible in the same literal sense as she does. Her answer will be interesting. So, the majority of Christians have NEVER taken the Bible literally, in the face value sense of literal. Faith never allows facts to get in the way of her claims. She is probably used to discussing these issues with other Christians who never doubt anything she says, she gets away with spouting nonsense with them and thinks it will work here. Brian.
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robinrohan Inactive Member |
I'll say it again, since you always ignore it: Your precious "majority opinion" also gave us the wonders of geocentrism and slavery. I don't see the point you are making, Ringo. Are you hinting that geocentrism and slavery are morally wrong? Isn't all morality subjective?
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Not everything that claims to be a canon is. Same as not everyone who claims to be a Christian is. God didn't bless all assemblies equally. Too funny.
However, if the fewest books are in all the canons then they are canonical. Go for the ones they all share if you want to be certain which are to be trusted. The ONLY books that are in ALL of the canons are the first five books.
Meanwhile I'll trust the 66-book Protestant Reformation canon. It holds together remarkably well. The "Gimme that Old Time Religion" defense yet again. Why Faith? Why is YOUR Canon inspired and the other Canons not inspired? What is the evidence you use to tell which is the God inspired one? Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
robinrohan writes: Are you hinting that geocentrism and slavery are morally wrong? Isn't all morality subjective? My point is that the "majority opinion" has changed. Most of the "majority" that Faith cites would disagree with her on a large number of issues. She can't claim "majority opinion" where it agrees with her and ignore it where it disagrees. There's no need to bring morality and/or subjectivity into every thread. Try to focus. Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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robinrohan Inactive Member |
I thought the point you were making was that majority opinion cannot be trusted:
The "majority opinion" is conspicuously and consistently fallible. Case in point: geocentrism and slavery--which are morally wrong. That was your point, but you switched it up in this latest post. You used the word "fallible" not "changeable."
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
robinrohan writes: I thought the point you were making was that majority opinion cannot be trusted: Yes - cannot be trusted because it keeps changing.
Case in point: geocentrism and slavery--which are morally wrong. That was your point If you're going to teach English, you really should learn to read it. I never said anything about "morally wrong". You used the word "fallible" not "changeable." The word "fallible" doesn't necessarily imply morality. Would "fickle" be less confusing to you? Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I'll say it again, since you always ignore it: Your precious "majority opinion" also gave us the wonders of geocentrism and slavery. The "majority opinion" is conspicuously and consistently fallible. And I've said it before and will say it again, slavery is endemic to the human race, and the revelation of the Bible is what finally did away with it. It died hard. It's hardwired in fallen human nature. And Galileo had to contend with Aristotle not the Bible. Aristotle's pagan geocentrism is what had taken root in the Catholic church, while the Bible was twisted to rationalize it.
And any "majority opinion" that takes the flood myth as literal history is also notoriously wrong. My point was that you are outnumbered. Your opinion is outnumbered. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
And I've said it before and will say it again, slavery is endemic to the human race, and the revelation of the Bible is what finally did away with it. It died hard. It's hardwired in fallen human nature. Yet the Bible both condones and demands the practice of Slavery beginning in Genesis and right straight through. There is NO place in the Bible where it says "Slavery is wrong and an abomination." Aslan is not a Tame Lion
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