Politics, Fantasy, and Reality

RR... no we did not see that. You only showed that they through off the state. Your explanation for their failure to take over proper distribution and control might be accurate, might not. Who knows? We don't have evidence, only a shift in the hypotheses.We never addressed the French Revolution regarding replacement of gov't mechanisms with revolutionary mechanisms. They created a new gov't to do that.On social democracy. Democracy existed before, during, and after France had its revolution. I don't owe them jack and it does not point to the potential for a stateless mass society. If that is NOT a people abandoning revolutionary mechanisms in order to form a new government, then it is purely a game of semantics on your part.

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holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

No, just you. You are a bigot.You set out the sad antiamerican tropes as if they are truth. You say you've seen Americans and they ALL fit that trope (which means they MUST be true). You've seen TV shows from america (in Africa) and it looks like those tropes (which means they MUST be true).You alter what I have said into statements that fit that trope, even when I haven't come close to saying such things. And you quote mine. All of this so you can say I fit some propaganda machine that is part of those tropes (which means they MUST be true).Thus by sitting still on your little porch of the world and avoiding any real contact, nor keeping your mind open to listen to what people are really saying, you keep those tropes in tact as realities... of that "anthropological research" you are doing?Your arguments generally boil down to ad hominem and guilt by association fallacies, which stem from your antiamerican bigotry.Notice you never even addressed the failed trope of my believing America is the free-est. You just said every single American you know believes that, and despite my existence to the contrary, I guess you'll just keep believing that.Bye bye archie.

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holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)

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a) why do you care,

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I care because this is a debate board with very high quality debate.I wish the quality to remain high.Comments like these lower the quality of debate.

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b) hre gave it himself,

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"Mommy, Billy hit me first!!"

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c) deliberate ignorant liars are not wirthy of respect.

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Deliberate infantile name-callers are not worthy of respect, either.

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Get off your high horse.

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And get down to your childish level? No thanks.

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Secondly, even if I conceded that China were more propagandised, which I do not due to the lower density of TV coverage, then the Us would be the 2nd most propagandised state on the planet today.

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Did you even read the excerpt from the link I supplied you?Chinese are not allowed to say anything bad or critical about the Chinese government on the internet or risk prosecution, and the providers must stop any such activity they find and report the activity to the government.In other words, If you were Chinese, and you were as critical of the Chinese government on your internet in China as you have been critical of the US government on this board, this server would have long ago been shut down and you would probably would have been in deep trouble with the authorities.Funny that you see little difference.

I also would like to point out to you, Contra, that there are many, many fringe and "alternative" news sources and political organisations here in the US that are constitutionally protected.Here is the website for the US communist party:Communist Party USA – cpusa.orgHere is the website for the US socialist party:Socialist Party USA - Hotel MoscaHere is a very well-known non-partisan source on the US web that seeks to expose the distortions of the truth by the media, called Fairness and Accuracy in Reporting, or FAIR:FAIR - FAIR is the national progressive media watchdog group, challenging corporate media bias, spin and misinformation.When I did a google search on the keywords, "George Bush Liar", 176,000 hits came back.Are you seriously going to tell me that China's government is not much, much more oppressive WRT what people are allowed to talk about over their internet in China compared to what Americans are allowed to talk about in the US?I myself saw a woman handing out fliers on socialism outside an alternative high school in my town the other week.Do you think she was rounded up by the feds and sent for some "reeducation", like she would have been in China?Please.This message has been edited by schrafinator, 09-26-2004 10:06 AM