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Author Topic:   Ancient Attribution: Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha‎
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 1 of 21 (254515)
10-24-2005 5:19 PM


In the “The Flood and Meat Eating” thread of the BA&I forum, Lam made the comment: ””but it was common practice in ancient times and up to the Renaissance for authors of ”certain works to not identify themselves or to sign their works. People back then believed ”that anything they did was for the glory of god and thus was expected to be humble ”enough to not claim their own work.
Do we have evidence that this was the practice of the OT or NT authors?”
Pseudepigraphy In Rabbinic Literature seems to show otherwise in the rabbinic era.”
First we should note that in the Mishnah, the ascription of a statement to a particular ”named sage marks that statement as a minority opinion.25 Rulings cited as the opinion of ””"the sages" in general are more authoritative.26 But rulings cited anonymously are ”understood to be the ruling of the Mishnah itself and are the most authoritative.27 Thus, in ”the Mishnah, anonymity confers authority, contrary to what we find in pseudepigraphy ”where false attribution to some specific, well-known and highly respected personality is ”generally used to increase the authority of a literary work, statement or idea.
Pseudepigrapha:
Writings ascribed to some other than their real author, generally with a view to giving ”them an enhanced authority. The term is used especially of the pseudonymous Jewish ”works dating from the centuries immediately before and after the beginning of the ”Christian era which were not included in the Greek Canon of the Old Testament. Among ”these writings are the "Book of Enoch", The Assumption of Moses", the later "Books of ”Baruch" and the "Psalms of Solomon".”
”1) Some New Testament scholars contend that Paul did not write the letter to the ”Collossians but that it was rather written pseudonomously and credited to Paul ””(Pseudepigraphy) to give it more importance.

”2) The word Pseudepigraphy from the Greek literally means ”false writing’ and we take it ”to mean falsely attributed writing.

”3) Pseudepigrapha is not unique to the New Testament. In the Old Testament the Books ”of Moses were not written by Moses but in his name as the great lawgiver.


This concept is important to us because many of the letters in the NT were written by ”other than the one to whom authorship is ascribed. This does not diminish the validity of ”the lesson. In fact they are wrongly attributed to increase the authority of the lesson.

These two excerpts do not seem to support the idea of humble anonymity.”
I realize that the Hebrew Bible is a compilation of various types of writings as is the NT. ”I am not saying that anonymous or pseudepigrapha are they only types.”
What I’m proposing is that the anonymous writings in the Hebrew Bible and New ”Testament do not seem to be anonymous due to human humility, but that anonymity and ”false attribution added authority.”

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by purpledawn, posted 10-25-2005 10:39 AM purpledawn has not replied
 Message 5 by Brian, posted 10-31-2005 4:36 AM purpledawn has replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 3 of 21 (254684)
10-25-2005 10:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by purpledawn
10-24-2005 5:19 PM


Bump for Discussion
I need some discussion this week.

"The average man does not know what to do with this life, yet wants another one which lasts forever." --Anatole France

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by purpledawn, posted 10-24-2005 5:19 PM purpledawn has not replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 4 of 21 (255387)
10-28-2005 5:51 PM


Book of James (Pseudepigraphal)
The Book of James is not considered to be written by James, the brother of Jesus, but is not considered to be written to deceive readers and present views contrary to the views of James himself.
Now a pseudepigraphal work may be a forgery, the intention being to deceive the readers into accepting views which the person credited the work would never have held. Thus in the New Testament, II Thessalonians, the Pastoral Epistles and I & II Peter are rightly called forgeries for they advocated views which were never held by the persons the writings were attributed to. However a pseudepigraphal document may also have been written by a disciple of the person attributed as the writer. The use of the teacher's name is then a way to tell the readers that the writings originate from his school. Indeed some scholars have suggested that the epistle of James could be a collection of traditional teachings attributed to James and the Jerusalem Church.
It is interesting to note that the author of James does not seem to share Paul's teachings, which would fit since James and the members of the Jerusalem Church remained Jewish in every sense of the word. Therefore a writer passing on the teachings of James would conflict with Paul's teachings. The book of James seems to uphold the Mosaic Laws.
So the author of this book does not seem to remain anonymous due to deference to God, but to pass on the teachings of his teacher.

"I refuse to think of them as chin hairs. I think of them as stray eyebrows." -Janette Barber-

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by idontlikeforms, posted 01-02-2006 4:21 PM purpledawn has replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 6 of 21 (255754)
10-31-2005 6:51 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Brian
10-31-2005 4:36 AM


Re: Old Testament as Pseudopigrapha
quote:
So, *if* there wasn't an historical David then wouldn't David's Psalms be pseudopigraphic?
Or would they be pseudonymous pseudopigrapha? Writings falsely attributed to a fictious name/person?
Seriously though, the name of the author of the songs could have been a David, just not King David. So I would still see it as a false attribution, if King David did not exist.
Although I'm not sure why songs would need authority behind them.

Nobody can make you feel inferior without your permission. -Eleanor Roosevelt-

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Brian, posted 10-31-2005 4:36 AM Brian has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by jar, posted 10-31-2005 7:45 AM purpledawn has replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 8 of 21 (255777)
10-31-2005 10:03 AM
Reply to: Message 7 by jar
10-31-2005 7:45 AM


Re: Old Testament as Pseudopigrapha
quote:
"In the Style of..." attribution
Were these ever presented in written form or were they usually oral presentations?

Nobody can make you feel inferior without your permission. -Eleanor Roosevelt-

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by jar, posted 10-31-2005 7:45 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by jar, posted 11-12-2005 11:27 AM purpledawn has not replied

  
purpledawn
Member (Idle past 3488 days)
Posts: 4453
From: Indiana
Joined: 04-25-2004


Message 18 of 21 (275614)
01-04-2006 3:18 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by idontlikeforms
01-02-2006 4:21 PM


Humble Anonymity or Pseudepigrapha
This is not a discussion about whether certain books are pseudepigrapha or not, but on the intent of authors of those books considered to be anonymous or pseudepigrapha. Please refer to Message 1.
We are discussing the intent behind writing an anonymous work or the intent behind attributing a written work to another person, usually someone of importance.
Did they remain anonymous for the glory of God?
Did a student write the book in the style of his teacher?
Not all the Pauline epistles are considered authentic.
Why did those authors attribute their work to Paul?
We are discussing the practices and styles of attribution.
The author of James appears to have been a student of James, the brother of Jesus, and wrote in the style appropriate to his teachings. It was not an uncommon practice supposedly.
Please keep the discussion in this vein if you wish to participate.

There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. -Edith Wharton

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by idontlikeforms, posted 01-02-2006 4:21 PM idontlikeforms has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by ramoss, posted 01-04-2006 8:22 AM purpledawn has not replied
 Message 20 by jar, posted 01-04-2006 11:26 AM purpledawn has not replied

  
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