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Author Topic:   Pope Tells Hawking Not to Study Origins of Universe
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 16 (321857)
06-15-2006 12:15 PM


quote:
HONG KONG (AP) - Famous astrophysicist Stephen Hawking said Thursday that the late Pope John Paul II once told scientists they should not study the beginning of the universe because it was the work of God.
Full article.
Just thought this was worth noting, for the next time someone says organized religion isn't out to stifle knowledge.

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by NosyNed, posted 06-15-2006 1:54 PM Dan Carroll has replied
 Message 5 by cavediver, posted 06-15-2006 2:03 PM Dan Carroll has not replied
 Message 6 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 2:10 PM Dan Carroll has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 16 (321920)
06-15-2006 2:01 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by NosyNed
06-15-2006 1:54 PM


Re: Fair play?
I'm heartily tempted to make a comment on the irony of defending the Catholic church when it comes to making statements on the true meaning of the words of someone long dead.
But I won't.
I will, however, ask how many ways there are to take the statement, "we should not enquire into the beginning itelf."

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by NosyNed, posted 06-15-2006 1:54 PM NosyNed has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by arachnophilia, posted 06-16-2006 3:47 PM Dan Carroll has not replied
 Message 16 by truthlover, posted 06-16-2006 4:08 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 16 (321944)
06-15-2006 2:50 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by rgb
06-15-2006 2:10 PM


Some elements of the Bush Administration have been known to withdraw fundings from science research groups whose conclusions contradict the Administration's claims in environmental issues.
No argument here. The Bush administration is absolutely out to stifle knowledge.
Harvard president got canned after remarking that perhaps the reason so fewer females are in the fields of science than males is because of the differences in brain physiology... or something like that.
And he later acknowledged that this statement was unsupported by research or scientific evidence.
Smacking someone around for saying something stupid isn't the same as demanding total ignorance on a subject.
The US government traded some Japanese war criminals' freedoms for mountains of data on research in biological warfare. These warcrimes were forgotten for a very long time.
Not sure where knowledge is being stifled there. In fact, it looks like you're saying that something was sacrificed to gain knowledge.
Even the scientific community from time to time rejects outright certain modifications in worldview.
Which is by no means the same as saying we shouldn't even investigate a subject.
So... don't know what to tell you. Most of these really don't hold up. But if your initial statement has been boiled back to "organized religion isn't out to stifle knowledge anymore than the Bush administration," we agree wholeheartedly.

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 2:10 PM rgb has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by rgb, posted 06-16-2006 3:19 PM Dan Carroll has replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 16 (321946)
06-15-2006 2:54 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by rgb
06-15-2006 2:10 PM


One other point:
Organized religion isn't out to stifle knowledge anymore than just about most other organizations and institutions that have ever existed.
Even if we assume this is true, so what? Does this somehow make it okay?

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by rgb, posted 06-15-2006 2:10 PM rgb has not replied

  
Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 16 (322346)
06-16-2006 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by rgb
06-16-2006 3:19 PM


In this particular case, social knowledge was stifled to gain scientific knowledge.
What knowledge was stifled? Everyone continued to know they comitted war crimes; they just weren't punished for it.
Call it awful if you want, but it's just not stifling knowledge.
True, but it tells us that religious organizations aren't the only ones uncomfortable with new and contradicting ideas to their already well established conceptions of the world.
Questioning a new idea, and subjecting it to scrutiny, is the opposite of saying we should not investigate it. This statement just makes you come off as if you're reaching really far, in silly ways, to defend religion.

"We had survived to turn on the History Channel
And ask our esteemed panel, Why are we alive? And here's how they replied:
You're what happens when two substances collide
And by all accounts you really should have died."
-Andrew Bird

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by rgb, posted 06-16-2006 3:19 PM rgb has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Chiroptera, posted 06-16-2006 3:30 PM Dan Carroll has not replied
 Message 14 by rgb, posted 06-16-2006 3:44 PM Dan Carroll has not replied

  
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