This false idea that the church caused the "Dark Ages" just has to be corrected AGAIN. The Dark Ages were caused by the simple reversion of Europe to its USUAL condition of darkness after the Roman Empire fell and its influence was no longer strong in Europe.
This seems to ignore the fact that at the same time the Spanish Caliphate was a bustling and tolerant civilization with the largest metropolitan areas in all of Europe such as Cordoba, with running water, with health care, with universities and a far higher standard of living, with Christian Monasteries and Nunneries.
The caliphate in question was not established until the 10th century, FAR into the "dark ages." What is your point?
Sispain.org
quote:
By the middle of the 8th century, the Muslims had completed their occupation and the Umayyad prince Abd al-Rahman, who had fled from the Abbasid slaughter of 750 A.D., took refuge among the Berbers. Finally, supported by one of the Peninsular Muslims tribes, the Yemenies, he managed to defeat, in 755, the Abbasid governor of Al-Andalus and have himself proclaimed in Cordoba Emir, independent of Damascus. In the first thrid of the 10th century, one of the Spanish Umayyads, Abd al- Rahman III, restored and extended the Al-Andalus emirate and became the first Spanish Caliph.
When I said the church was barely established in Europe I clearly meant at the fall of the Roman Empire, 6 centuries earlier.
That left the barely established European Church as the only civilizing influence, and that is how it functioned, more and more as it grew over the centuries. It was a force for order and morality among the warring tribes, and it preserved much of the works of civilization.
What? Barely established? The only civilizing influence? It was the Church that carried out many of the barbarities of the era. You yourself admit that it became a political power, but then you retreat into your "not real Christians" copout and defense. That is an interesting tactic but seems really selfserving. They were Christians, not very good Christians but Christians none the less. To connect the Dark Ages with Protestant Revolution (or Reformation depending on your POV) is just silly.
You are talking about the later Middle Ages when the church's apostasy was in full bloom.
The Dark Ages extended from around 400CE to around 1000CE. The Protestant Revolution was a 16th. Century event.
Yes, the very dates I had in mind. And your point is?
Just as with the fall of the Soviet Union, communication led to the end of the Dark Ages. Travelers and in particular Monks and Nuns returning from Caliphate Spain brought back both the knowledge to be found there as well as tales of the wonderous cities and universities and running water and plumbing and the world of ideas and free thought and Jews and Muslims and Christians living together and debating as equals and teh markets and foods found under the rule of the Caliphs.
You are just throwing out odd bits of information without placing them in time. What years are you talking about? Brought knowledge to whom when? And so what?
But that did not change the fact that the driving force of the Christian Church, throughout much of history was the destruction of the civilizations it found, as can be seen in this painting "The Truimph of Christianity."
Oh jar, what marvelous EVIDENCE there, a PAINTING by somebody to illustrate some personal opinion of his. You must be joking.
There WAS no civilization in Europe proper when the Roman Empire fell. What are you talking about? In 400 AD Europe was nothing but a bunch of tribes, Franks and Goths and Celts and so on. I gather Spain had been more civilized by the Roman Empire than other parts of Europe in those early years though.
And , the Church DID preserve the pagan classics and pass them on to Europe.
This page of Schaff's History of the Church covers the period of mostly stagnation in the church of the middle ages, mentions the ABSENCE of libraries and claims that the old libraries had been destroyed by the BARBARIANS. There is no hint that Christianity had any desire to do away with libraries, but quite the reverse.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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