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Author Topic:   Is the world a construct of my imagination?
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 15 of 33 (353059)
09-29-2006 7:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Christian7
09-27-2006 9:29 PM


Stop torturing yourself with thoughts of fear
Reality is at odds with consciousness. Our dreams are inconsistent, reality is consistent. In our minds we want things immediately, in reality, things just happen how they occur. God wouldn't submitt himself to harm if he exists, because logically, all evidence shows that living things protect themselves.
Because you cannot feel others' thoughts doesn't mean they don't exist. From my perspective, this universe is all my dream, because I can't feel your thoughts. Get your lil feeler out and look at those lil happy babas enjoying toys. How can you say they are robots!! I, like you, cannot feel their minds with my baba feeler. Everybody has the same problem!
The fact is, that if you were God, then you would always make it so that you could get what you want eventually
Since you don't always get what you want and you've ended up this way, you cannot be God. That's a pretty solid conditional implication because any God worth his salt just wouldn't be that stupid. Cetainly he wouldn't be able to make such an elaborate playstation game called, "Guido Arbia".
I cannot grasp the fact that they are conscious beings such as myself
Neither can anyone, fully, because your consciousness is limited to your being. If anything, this is an evidence that people WHO ARE CONSCIOUS, are limited to their own bodies. This detachment, actually evidences that because of your complete inability to feel their consciousness, they must have their own, because if it wasn't theirs you'd be able to feel it.
If they were you, they would act exactly how you do, and not be able to perform brilliantly, according to diversity within conscious beings. Because they out-perform your consciousness in many areas, and don't mimic your abilities, then logically this suggests that people therefore have their own consciousness. Perhaps you cannot do art. If you take a course you'll improve, but you'll never be DaVinci.
You've got to acknowledge that nobody has a "feeler". We can only empathize by putting ourselves in other people's shoes. Everybody, like you, considers that they are the one's with the only consciousness, and that it is all a dream. If it is, another consciousness would have had to imprison us in this dream. If you are God, then you'd simply wake up.
You have to start thinking logically, and read over this post, instead of getting worried and confirming the delusion.
Hope this helped.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Christian7, posted 09-27-2006 9:29 PM Christian7 has not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 25 of 33 (353586)
10-02-2006 9:59 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by Christian7
09-29-2006 7:54 PM


Good stuff Guido!
Hi Guido.
You've pretty much got the downpat here. (Atleast in my twurp-opinion)
What I mean is, in essence, one is pure consciousness. Thus, nothing belongs to them. A person is a construct of consciousness, developed personality, and memory. Something can only belong to a person, not a consciousness
I understand what you mean. Maybe we just think similarly, but I seem to get what you mean on a level of reading between your lines. As for long syllogisms, I only understand them after reading them about twenty times.
By consciousness you mean our thoughts cannot own anything, in a way, because it is just the construct of having a mind. I thought that was a clever perception of the matter.
The world then MUST exist in the unconscious? I don't think you can infer B2. It seems to be a conclusion rather than a premise.
The world comes via the senses,(the body), and then into the mind which perceives it. I don't think it's so much consciousness and unconsciousness. I observe that you like to compartmentalize things. It's handy for logical specifics, as I do the same, but sometimes things merge. The subconscious and consciousness is very much a part of the brain.
C1. The world does not exist within one’s own mind.
C2. The world is independent from one’s own mind.
C3. The world clearly interacts with one’s self.
C4. The personality is in the world.
C5. What is seen in the contents of the consciousness is caused by what is in the world.
Correct, imho.
We observe people that have the same conscious nature as ourselves.
Yes. People (X) - you (A). The world (W)
Since W interacts with your person (A), then it's reasonable to assume that other recognisable persons (A's), also have a consciousnes, because we observe that; "The personality is in the world." Since we can touch, observe, and observe toher persons, that behave in the same manner as A, it's reasonable to conclude that because they are also persons, the must also have a consciousness. Perhaps it can't be proved, but all of the evidence allows us to have fairly meaningful premisses.
"G. Other people exist, thus there are other consciousnesses beside us." Excellent!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Christian7, posted 09-29-2006 7:54 PM Christian7 has not replied

  
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4755
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 26 of 33 (353590)
10-02-2006 10:11 AM
Reply to: Message 20 by Christian7
09-29-2006 7:54 PM


Re: I think I solved the riddle.
The Guido Syllogism
---Guido is in the world.--- (fact)
P1. People are in the world via Guido's observation.
(Since Guido's consciousness inteprets other people from his bodily senses)
P2. The person owns consciousness (like Guido baba)
P3. Peter(whom Guido observes) is regarded under category "people"
Conclusion: Therefore Peter is in the world, and is a person whom is therefore conscious.
I think that's valid. Maybe someone could confirm that for us.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 20 by Christian7, posted 09-29-2006 7:54 PM Christian7 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by kuresu, posted 10-02-2006 12:23 PM mike the wiz has not replied

  
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