Even if there was a Designer, does it matter?

I would imagine it could provide additional insight into how the designer did what he/she/it did. By knowing who the designer was we could gleam what the designer’s purpose was. Or seek additional ways to have direct input from said designer. Imagine how much we could know if we could get it directly from the source. Instead of having to painstakingly discover and assimilate each new piece of evidence. I think that the importance of truly knowing who the designer was could have an almost endless amount of consequences for the world. For example, we could finally stop all this mess of holy wars against religions that differ from our chosen path. If everyone knew for a fact that it was Bob Dobbs that created the universe, than it would be silly to have so many varied religions and disputes over which religion is correct. It was Bob Dobbs end of discussion, get back to slacking off.Edited by rueh, : spelling

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Well it does supply an answer for pure curiosities sake. It also allows us to be able to determine how we can live life so as to fulfill that purpose. So yes I think it does matter for some at least to know the purpose of why the designer did what they did.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

In your OP you ask I am merely providing additional areas where knowing the identity of said designer could have value for some people. It may not hold value for you, but there are others out there I imagine that would find importance in it. Being able to tell if life was actualy designed or not would open up other areas of research into who the designer was, how they operated, why they did what they did. These are areas of value that go beyond historical footnotes or product liability. Edited by rueh, : Change message subtitle

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Well as I said previously it provides additional areas of research. That is certainly more than a historic footnote. Maybe I am missing your point on historic footnote. Why do think that new lines of evidence or areas of research are merely historical footnotes?

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello Jar, hope you had a good new year’s celebration. But these are all things that we have everyday experience with. Do you believe that your analogy holds true for something that we have no experience with. For example if we were to find a piece of alien technology? Wouldn't discerning the identity of that designer be a priority for those investigating? Wouldn't knowing the identity lead to further areas of investigation? I believe the same is true for our hypothetical designer of life. By knowing who the designer is we may be able to answer questions such as why they designed a certain way or how they designed to begin with. I believe that chalking it up to mere historic footnotes doesn't even begin to answer all the new questions that will arise from knowing the identity of the designer.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

I guess that I don't see these questions as historical footnotes because they have modern day applications. Knowing who the designer is leads to questioning why the designer did what they did and that can give us an idea of what we are expected to do in our everyday life. It may not change everyone’s perspective, as in your using a radio for a doorstop (personally I believe everything can be used as a hammer) example but it would certainly affect some. That certainly is of more importance than an interesting footnote of what Mr. Ford did. I guess that knowing the exact identity of the designer would be important if we want to eliminate supernatural causes for existence. For instance if we determine that life has been designed but it was not through naturalistic causes, than we can turn our attention to being able to investigate the supernatural. Just how exactly we do that is beyond me or the scope of the OP but it would provide us direction for investigation. Conversely if we find that life was designed and it was through naturalistic methods than we can further eliminate the possibility provided by some of supernatural forces in life’s formation.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello Panda,
Yeah I kind of realize that my analogy was not much better. However I was trying to think of an example of something where no known inventor could be proposed. Where the identity could have ramifications that are beyond historical footnotes. I agree that we have experience with life; however I thought that for this debate we were assuming that the designer in some form or fashion does indeed exist and is responsible for life as we know it. In which case being able to investigate the "how" of the designer creating life is just as much tied into the "who" or "why". I just don't see how you could separate them if for this hypothetical example the designer did truly exist. If I am beyond the limits of this hypothetical example than I guess Jar can let us know.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello ringo, I agree, however knowing the identity doesn't necessarily preclude any assets. As I mentioned earlier we may be able to further expand our investigative techniques to include the supernatural. If by knowing the designers identity we discover that there are certain aspects of life that are beyond naturalistic explanation. Or we can begin to search where the designers of life originated to begin with. If we determine that life was created naturally by aliens, for example.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello jar, Well if we knew that it was Brahma that created life it may lead people towards Buddhism. That is one aspect of knowing the identity that can have real world aspects that effect how people would behave in their everyday life. True we can live our lives with whatever intent we deem appropriate, however if we knew that the designer was in fact the Judaic god, than his intent could have ramifications if we live life opposite of his intentions. This could shape the way that people live their everyday lives. We may be able to live life with intent that it was never ment for. Just as we can use silly putty for applications that it was not designed for. That does not mean that some people wouldn't want to know what the original intentions for life are/were. Or if we discover that it was aliens that created life. Wouldn't we want to know why they are seeding the universe with life? I imagine that we would also want to be able to commune with the aliens and knowing their identity could point us in which direction we would need to travel in order to do so.In a purely hypothetical situation such as this discussion, nothing is off limits. So I just don't see how you believe that the ramifications of such a discovery can all be summed up by liability or historical footnotes?Edited by rueh, : expanding my point.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

But the design or maker of a model t has no bearing on your life. The designer of all life does have direct bearing on your life because depending on who the designer is, it may come with ramifications. I don't see how you can conflate the two models. One is a car the other is all life as we know it, two very different things. It has relevance because by knowing the identity, we can hope to garner their intentions. In the case of the Judaic god going against his intentions seems to come with many negative aspects. Or conversely by knowing who it is not we could eliminate superfluous aspects of life brought on by dogma. Awww so that is something that matters beyond liability or historical footnote. Deciding whether or not we wish to further our investigations. I think you just answered your OP. There are other issues that arise and that matter from knowing the identity of the designer.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello Panda, Well Jar in the OP never specified exactly which designer we are talking about. It could have been a designer that accomplished their work and have then been absent in their creation. Or it could be a designer that does have active control over their creation. Since it's not specified any options proposed for the designer bear just as much weight as every other option. If the designer created the universe and then had no further input since its inception than yes they may well be regulated to footnote status. However that is another area of investigation that would need to be studied if we ever found that life was truly designed.
The elephant in the room that everyone has been ignoring is the fact that what we think we know about the processes of life could be completely wrong if life is ever discovered to have been designed. We would need to revamp how we investigate life and knowing who the designer is and the how and why of their designing could certainly have a role to play with further investigation.Edited by rueh, : spelling

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Hello Jar, Really Jar? You need me to spell out how the creator of a car has less significance than the designer of possibly every atom in the universe? It's not obvious to you how one could have more future ramifications than the other? Maybe but you do not specify which type of designer we are talking about. If it were aliens for example we may not need to worry about what occurs to us or even the possibility of an afterlife. However it certainly would shake the foundations of some people’s religious views, just as the evolutionary explanations currently proposed do. However if an omnipotent and active designer such as the Judaic god were to be discovered than the future ramifications that could be present simply by living your life would have a huge impact on many folks lives.I'll try to expand my points later. I have to get to work now. Thanks for the interesting conversation so far.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Well it may be totally irrelevant since we are unable to measure any effects that god has on his creation. However in your scenario you propose that design and a designer have been found. So if it were found not to be the god you believe in. That would have no relevancy on your life? That wouldn't cause you to reflect on your current belief system? No I meant more of active versus inactive designer. An inactive designer probably would have no importance other than a footnote. Unless the designer proposed had set rules for humanities behavior that are enforceable upon death. Versus an active designer, in which case we would need to reexamine everything we currently understand about the development of life. Since an active designer would have constant input. What we see as current driving forces of evolution would need to be explained through how the designer manipulates these forces.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

An intervening designer is a "type" of designer. The OP never specifies which type of designer we are dealing with. It just says designer in general. I am just proposing that the type of designer whether it is active, inactive can have implications beyond footnotes. For example if the god of Judaism was found to be the designer. Than knowing who designed the universe could have serious ramifications since living your life not in accordance with god's will (what ever that may be) could affect how you spend eternity. This is the easiest example of how knowing the "who" of the designer can have important implications for humanity.If you want to make this hypothetical situation as bland as it can be. Than yes you can narrow its scope down far enough that the identity of the designer can have no impact on scientific understanding or humanities response. However the type of designer proposed has a direct correlation with the amount of impact that the identity of the designer will have on people.Who the designer is can be useful in order for us to reevaluate the way in which we conduct our experiments. If supernatural explanations need to be incorporated with our current understandings for example. It could be important if we want to determine how to establish communications with the designer. If as Jar has already mentioned earlier we need to decide as a people to communicate with the designer if possible. It could be important on how people view the world and how they live their lives. If aliens were found to be the designers of life, you would probably see new religions springing forth that worship the aliens or converts to Judaism or Christianity if it was found to be god. The "what" of the designer’s creation is only useful in a scientific sense and even then in a very narrow sense of our understanding. I realize that science as of now only concerns itself with a very mechanical approach of how life behaves and evolves. This hypothetical situation is not dealing with our current understanding of science though. It is proposing that our current models are wrong because of the fact that it presupposes it is all from the will of the designer. In which case science could radically change if they knew which designer of all the hypothetical’s it in fact is.Edited by rueh, : No reason given.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX

Does the desinger of your car impact how you believe you will spend eternity? But the hypothetical situation that you originaly proposed is not dealing with out current understanding of evolution. It presupposes that our understanding of evolution is flawed. Since current theories do not incorporate a designer. That entirely depends of the "type" of designer. If for example we suppose an active designer. Than our unsderstanding of those forces may never be complete since they could be "tweeked" at any time by the designer.

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'Qui non intelligit, aut taceat, aut discat'
The mind is like a parachute. It only works when it is open.-FZ
The industrial revolution, flipped a bitch on evolution.-NOFX