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Author Topic:   random questions
truthlover
Member (Idle past 4090 days)
Posts: 1548
From: Selmer, TN
Joined: 02-12-2003


Message 10 of 20 (88090)
02-23-2004 5:54 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by notsosure
01-26-2004 11:41 PM


Historicaly this way of thinking has lead to bloodshed and they feel this is justified or okay because their God says so. Am I understanding this correctly? If so, then basically I can only conclude that religious indifference will be the cause of our extiction.
I don't think it will lead to our extinction. We survived most of the world being under the leadership of religion-based governments, and now much of the world is not. If religion couldn't extinguish us over the last few millennia, I suspect it's not going to now.
Historicaly this way of thinking has lead to bloodshed and they feel this is justified or okay because their God says so. Am I understanding this correctly?
Unfortunately, this seems true to me. This issue is the toughest one for me as a believer. I've survived the transition to believing in evolution, and I've survived a lot of the kind of arguments I've heard on these boards, but this one is tough; real tough.
The fact is, Jesus didn't preach this kind of religion (based on the Gospels), but if Jesus is the Son of the God of the Israelites, and if the Torah represents the will of God, then Jesus' Father ordered the genocide of several groups of people. So while it's easy to defend Jesus' preaching (I think), it's pretty hard to defend his Father's actions.
So now, what do I do, so that I can in some way justify my status as a believer in Jesus? That's the question for me.
Here's my current answer. The Israelites did indeed conquer Canaan and produce a kingdom. Joshua and Judges disagree on exactly how that happened. Archeologists tell us the Judges description is the more accurate one. Either way, it wasn't written down until later, maybe much later.
I don't think God ordered the extermination of the rest of the Canaanites. I think the Israelites conquered the land of Canaan, driving out or taking over the other tribes of the area, and later they wrote down their history, however accurately or inaccurately. I don't think God wanted any particular history, but I do think he took a people for himself, the nation of Israel. When the time was right, he sent his Son to make a new nation; one that didn't have a government or even a land. It would consist not just of Israel, but of every tongue, tribe, and people, and it would not have an army, nor conquer by force.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by notsosure, posted 01-26-2004 11:41 PM notsosure has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by nator, posted 02-23-2004 9:05 AM truthlover has replied

  
truthlover
Member (Idle past 4090 days)
Posts: 1548
From: Selmer, TN
Joined: 02-12-2003


Message 11 of 20 (88091)
02-23-2004 5:57 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by crashfrog
01-27-2004 1:50 AM


:ae: writes:
Maybe I should've said that it's less violent on such a large and organized scale as it has been in the past.
crashfrog writes:
Well, I certainly agree with that.
I agree, too, but it's only fair to point out that it's probably only true because of circumstances. Restore large and organized Christian (or most any other religion) governments, and I think it's safe to say that you'll see large and organized violence again. I would present the smaller scale violence in Ireland and the Middle East as my evidence for that.

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 Message 6 by crashfrog, posted 01-27-2004 1:50 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
truthlover
Member (Idle past 4090 days)
Posts: 1548
From: Selmer, TN
Joined: 02-12-2003


Message 18 of 20 (88126)
02-23-2004 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by nator
02-23-2004 9:05 AM


Except that the technology to quickly vaporize millions and kill millions more over several more weeks, plus make the shattered land uninhabitable for years, is available to religious extremists now.
Oh, yeah.
Although, even in this case, we're not talking about extinction. Despite the earlier tongue-in-cheek (I hope) comment, the superpowers are not religious extremists.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by nator, posted 02-23-2004 9:05 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by nator, posted 02-26-2004 10:12 AM truthlover has not replied

  
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