Melchizidek is an OT character. He precedes the Christian church. There is no OT evidence for any notion of him not having ancestors, it appears to be a (fairly late) Christian idea.
The evidence is in the Letter to the Hebrews chapter 7 which I just quoted. It was not "fairly late." If you are a Christian presumably you accept the New Testament as revelation, and it often interprets the Old Testament in opposition to the way the Jews interpret it.
It is only a few modern "scholars" who have capitulated to "young woman" over the absolutely foundational "virgin."
Well that is your opinion. I disagree.
Um, a historical question is not a matter of opinion but of fact. You "disagree" that only a few modern scholars have done this? How odd. The entire church until the last century or so affirmed the virgin birth.
Besides, why are "modern" scholars somehow automatically wrong when they happen to be Biblical scholars but you have no problem accepting the findings of modern scholars over ancient scholars when it comes to something like the study of medicine or astronomy?
This makes sense how? The Bible is a supernatural revelation. If you have scholars who deny the supernatural, as many do these days, they are not trustworthy. We aren't talking about the physical world which doesn't require them to have a supernatural belief.
Even Paul, whom you put much stock in, does not refer to Jesus as being born of a virgin and he explicity refers to Jesus as coming from the seed of David (male line through Joseph)
Yes, this is what has given me pause too, and why I always assumed Jesus had human inheritance through his mother, never having heard otherwise as far as I recall. But if the logic I have been pursuing now holds up, and so far nobody has even addressed it let alone disputed it, then it appears He does not have GENETIC or PHYSICAL inheritance from David or anyone. The inheritance is completely legal, through his parents, one of them his adoptive father, who were descended from David.
Galatians 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law...
Romans
1:1 Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,
2 (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)
3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;
Yes, that is how I was convinced too. But answer the logic I have been pursuing here. If he inherited physically from any human being he would have inherited sin, and he can't have inherited sin if he was to be the spotless lamb of sacrifice. I think perhaps this whole idea has been obscure in church history until recently. Yet the letter to the Hebrews seems to suggest that it was known that Jesus had no human parentage, just as Adam didn't.
"Made of the seed of David according to the flesh" is true in any case, as he was born into a family of David.
I believe everything I said about Jesus' having no ancestry is logically derivable from scripture, not to mention verified by the quote I posted, and you have not answered any of it.
I have never seen any scripture that suggests that Mary was not the mother of Jesus so what can you possibly be talking about?
I do wish you would address the logic I have been following here. It is perfectly cogent. Of course Mary was his mother, she bore him.
Mothers pass their genes unto their children.
Normally they do. But the birth of Jesus was unique.
That is how it usually works unless it is a surrogate mother and I doubt that there was an embryo implantation done on Mary but of course if you have some evidence of that by all means share it.
Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit says scripture. Why do you bring up such a ridiculous image from modern medicine? It is irrelevant. None of this is any more mysterious than the virgin birth itself. That's not how it "usually works" either. Either he inherited Mary's genes or He didn't. It looks to me now like He didn't.
The reference to Melchizidek is not evidence, however much you want to assert that it is. Even if one accepts the account in Hebrews "in toto" it does not say that Jesus had no ancestry.
I'm sorry I was not on my toes in my first answer to you, but it does in fact say that Jesus had no ancestry. That is where the revelation comes from.
It says he was a priest "after the order of Melchizedek". It doesn't say what that means or that it means that Jesus has no ancestry.
Yes it does.
That is a leap of logic and highly interpretative/speculative on your part.
Not on my part. It was taught me by conservative Bible teachers.
On the contrary, the reference to Melchizidek appears to be a way of contrasting the priesthood of Jesus with the priesthood of Aaron and the Levites - in other words, the Law.
Yes, and the contrast is about the temporariness of the Law and its priesthood but the eternal permanence of the Melchizedek priesthood which is Jesus' priesthood.
Melchizidek is set up as being superior to Aaron and thus the priesthood of Jesus supersedes the priesthood of Aaron. There is some discussion of that (Hebrews 7) and this contrast (Jesus vs. Levitical Law) appears to be the point of the reference, which makes sense in light of the fact that Hebrews is directed at Jewish Christians, who would be the ones needing this kind of instruction.
That is so, and if you read Hebrews 7 how is it that you overlooked the statement that Melchizedec was without beginning or end or ancestry?
And I haven't even delved into the "rod of Jesse" (Isaiah 11: 1-2) and the Matt. 1 and Luke 3 genealogies. All of these would argue against "no human ancestry" AND "no human male ancestry" in particular.
First I'd like to see you address the logic as I have presented it, concerning the need for perfect sinlessness, which echoes the OT requirement for an "unblemished" or "spotless" lamb of sacrifice.
I think we know more now than many did throughout the history of the church. I suspect all this was rather vague in many minds. But it seems to me it is unavoidable at this point that Jesus had to have been made brand new in the womb.
™ Version 4.2