Was Christ a communist?

This sounds like some other speculations I've heard. Sometimes there are some asinine discussions on whether Jesus was a liberal or a conservative; a Democrat or a Republican. He is neither. Jesus is Jesus-- and there is no other like him.As you've alluded to, there are some forms of communism that are more compatible with Christianity then others. Stalinism is in no way compatible with Christianity, and neither is Marxism. However, since the ideal of communism is a very pure belief, the real question is why no one is able to make it a lasting reality. Acts 2: 42, 44, and 45:

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And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and in fellowship ... 44 And all that believed were together, and had all things in common; 45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.

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All this is saying is that they left behind their worldly goods and gave them to the needy, so they can take up Jesus' last command, which is the Great Commission. I don't see communism anywhere in there.Matthew 19:16-24

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And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life? 17 And he said unto him, Why do you ask me about what is good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. 18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, 19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. 22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions. 23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.

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This is a caveat about the superficial love of money and how to avoid its pitfalls. Communism is the ideal to destroy the culture of the proletarian by removing class structure and subverting the status quo. You are making communism out to be a society where people give things away, where you get something for nothing. That isn't even slightly true. What may appear to be free healthcare or free housing is not. In a communist economy, most of your earnings go to taxes. You have to pay into those services just like anyone else.These verses are talking about giving to the poor as a charitable deed to the needy. I see no similarity.About the most similarity I see with the early Apostles were that they lived in a communal environment. This wasn't for everyone. These men left behind their families for long periods of time. Obviously that type of environment would not be conducive to a whole society. I think it is a mistake make parallels with an economic system with a moral issue. This is what ultimately drives communism to its failure. Its supposed to be an economic system, that slowly synthesizes into an ideology that writes checks it simply cannot cash. It can't make due on its promises.

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"Somewhere at the back of my father's mind, at the bottom of his heart, in the depth of his soul, there was an empty space that had once been filled by God and he never found anything else to put in it... At the centre of me is always an eternally terrible pain - a curious wild pain - a searching for something beyond what the world contains." -Bertrand Russell

precisely. and after we have given according to our conviction, we will be judged by our intentions. he will decide if we have given what he told us to give.my general policy is to give when i have the opportunity and the means. thus, i haven't failed to give when i ought to have. but i also judge my donations wisely so that it is not wasted. i don't give say, to the christian childrens fund, because they have all those fancy ads. also, i don't think aid should be predicated and dependent on religious training.

I hesitate to use the modern terminology. I think Jesus would have agreed with, "From each according to his ability, to each according to his need." But He would have emphasized that the distribution was up to individual consciences. Once again, the terminology is a stumbling block. I could say that I'm a democrat and a republican, but that would confuse our American readers. Similarly, the terms "communist" and "socialist" carry too much baggage."Was Christ a communist?" makes a good provocative title, but I don't think the debate will go anywhere if we dwell too much on the words.

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I'm glad you brought up government. Communists, including Christian communists, tend to believe in the eventual abolition of the state, as explained here from wiki: Christian communists can also argue that as Christians support laws that back up their faith in many areas (e.g. against murder, because "Thou shalt not kill") they should also support laws related to the redistribution of wealth and ownership of the means of production.

Perhaps the Christian communists could argue that no society has ever had enough real Christians in it to make it work, and that large scale Christian communism has never been tried. They could point out that nominal Christians don't follow the teachings of the communist Christ anyway. Are you sure that's not just wishful thinking on your part, Nemesis? That seems to say very clearly that rich men have got about as much chance of getting to heaven as you have of becoming the Queen of England!

I agree about the problems with terminology. Perhaps we could say that Christ preached voluntary communism.

What "ultimately" drives communism to its failure, in history, is a rival government/society/culture spending billions and billions in a concerted effort to make it fail. The atrocities inflicted on communist experiments are in no way an argument against Jesus being a communist.

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I could almost agree with that. I shouldn't have two pairs of shoes as long as somebody else has none. But there's a practical side to it.Instead of buying a second pair of shoes, I could give the money to a shoeless man. But how do I know he would spend the money on shoes instead of booze? I could buy a new pair and give him my old pair, but how do I know he wouldn't sell them to buy booze?The long and short of it is that his shoelessness depends on himself as well as on me. I can't force anybody to have shoes.That's why the emphasis should be on individual choices rather than collective.

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I expect that the Christian communists could point out that "to each according to his needs" would mean that the guy would always have shoes, and that comfortable rehab places would be available, but if an alcoholic counted alcohol as a need, he would have enough of that, too. If he were a good Christian alcoholic, he would also feel the responsibility to work to the best of his abilities.I'm neither a Christian or a communist, but the point of the thread is really whether or not Christ was ( a communist, that is, as I think we can safely describe him as a Christian of sorts - non-denominational, presumably).

but believing in the abolition of the state and actually achieving such are entirely different. besides, the state is not the exclusive domain of government. government is a fancy word for the organization of society. the rule of law does not require a state system. communism is kind of designed around local elected government councils or soviets. this word was utilized and not invented by the russians. the simplified explanation that people in this country get about communism is quite flawed.'first the capitalists are overthrown by a mob and then there is an anarchical system where people just give each other stuff.'it's crap. capitalism develops into a socialist system of the redistribution of wealth to ensure that everyone gets both what they need and what they deserve. see norway. everyone has at least a living wage and there is increased income for those with higher training or education. eventually everyone pursues the higher wages and the social distinctions begin to disappear until the social values equalize as well. at this point, there's no real political differences. there are some, say, i think we need to better support fire services over increased clinics, but the fundamental political differences disappear. then, there's no real need or desire for a government outside of an oversight body to ensure the continuation of the distribution of goods and services. this is kind of inherently democratic in that the people then elect the officers who will support the specific programs they think are most needed instead of electing people who will fundamentally change the government. but there is still a need for oversight. this is wherein the problems with communism occur. these officers often are corrupted by the control they have over the resources.further, capitalism, not communism, is the anarchical system. it has simply tended to be controlled by government regulation.this is an occasion where wiki is really not your best source. i'd suggest a solid comparitive political theory book... and that's not one that discusses current governments and compares their populations and shit.

there is no such thing as voluntary communism. either the whole society is involved or there is no communism. jesus preached charity. you can't make it communism no matter how hard you try.

and yet you keep arguing about christians being communists. that's not a legitimate argument. just because i have a classfull of students who decide to start a genocide after attending my class doesn't mean i'm a genocidaire.

I agree with the simplified explanation that people get about communism and: I have read some political theory long ago in my youth, but that wiki quote is adequate for these purposes. I'm also European, so I've known quite a few communists in my time!Christian communists, apparantly, want to evolve the state away. But however they perceive their way forward, you don't agree that Christ was a communist, anyway, so if you're a Christian, what about Christ being described as a socialist in his general ethos? Lots seems to point to that, surely. He doesn't seem to be the type of character who would approve of an economic system that's powered by greed and selfishness, does he?

What's not a legitimate argument? I can argue that Christ was a communist in the same way that I can argue that Karl Marx was a communist. I don't have to be a Christian or a communist or a Marxist in order to do so.

i don't think jesus really cares about economic systems. christians are supposed to live for today apparently and look for treasure in heaven. they are supposed to be in but not of the world.as far as i can tell, government and economics are not for christians. otherwise, paul would have been working on overthrowing the government, no? it seems to me, though, that jesus was interested in the actions of individuals, not of states or governments. i'll tell you again. jesus was interested in individual self-denial and charity, not in a social system of equalization or redistribution of wealth.