Author
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Topic: Evolution impossible as cannot apply meaning to code
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Message 4 of 107 (403671)
06-04-2007 6:48 PM
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Reply to: Message 1 by WS-JW 06-04-2007 4:28 PM
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WS-JW,
The genetic code could not have been built without a creator to apply meaning to that code. Demonstrate that the genetic code has meaning. If you can't do that then your entire argument falls flat. I've seen similar arguments that invoke a sender for genetic information. DNA has information, therefore God was the sender. Of course, if there is no god then DNA contains no information: so what? Your argument is the same, if god doesn't exist then the genetic code has no meaning, & I ask again;so what? Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
This message is a reply to: | | Message 1 by WS-JW, posted 06-04-2007 4:28 PM | | WS-JW has not replied |
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Message 29 of 107 (403823)
06-05-2007 10:05 AM
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Reply to: Message 9 by WS-JW 06-04-2007 9:20 PM
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WS-JW,
And why ever they say that natural selection seperates the good from the bad I don't know... in science you find the good stuff breaks down ever so quickly and the bad bits you can't get rid of.
Demonstrable bollocks. In 1982 Barry Hall (Hall 1982) excised the genes that cleaves lactose, the expression control system, & the lactose permease from E.Coli. All three re-evolved elsewhere in the genome when the bacteria was allowed access to lactose.
Thus an entire system of lactose utilization had evolved, consisting of changes in enzyme structure enabling hydrolysis of the substrate; alteration of a regulatory gene so that the enzyme can be synthesized in response to the substrate; and the evolution of an enzyme reaction that induces the permease needed for the entry of the substrate. One could not wish for a batter demonstration of the neoDarwinian principle that mutation and natural selection in concert are the source of complex adaptations. [DJ Futumya, Evolution, ©1986, Sinauer Associates, Sunderland, MA. pp. 477-478.] Not bad for no-monkeys-whatsoever-tapping-at-a-typwriter, eh? All this was achieved by mutation & natural selection.
The failed evolution experiments and getting life out by chance support this also. What failed experiments? Hall, among many others, showed us that new function can arise naturalistically. If the genome contains information, then we have experimental verification that new information can arise. If we have new function, then we must have new information coding for it. Mark Edited by mark24, : No reason given. Edited by mark24, : typo
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
This message is a reply to: | | Message 9 by WS-JW, posted 06-04-2007 9:20 PM | | WS-JW has not replied |
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Re: disjunction can be continuous in discontinuous space
Brad,
Well isn't *this* a can of worms?? No, QM is in no way contradictory to RM & NS either gradualistic or punctuationary. Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
This message is a reply to: | | Message 51 by Brad McFall, posted 06-08-2007 10:43 AM | | Brad McFall has replied |
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Re: disjunction can be continuous in discontinuous space
Brad,
I only said that QM has not been properly worked into theoretical biology. Why does it need to be? Biologists need to understand the patterns of behaviour of atoms & molecules, of course, but understanding that a mutation occurred because X reacted with Y at Z stage of meiosis is good enough. Anything else is physics.
I said the problem depends on if "range" is meant for individuals or species. I fail to see it as a problem for either. Understanding the chemistry that affects both is good enough. Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Message 62 of 107 (404846)
06-10-2007 5:13 AM
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Reply to: Message 61 by WS-JW 06-10-2007 3:17 AM
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WS-JW,
These will help you my friends. No, it won't. We don't debate websites. It would be nice if you actually responded point by point to our replies. This is a forum for debate, not prosetylisation. It goes like this, you make an opening post, I reply, you respond to my replies & so on. What you are not going to be allowed to do is make an OP, ignore all responses & then provide URL's for websites. THIS IS NOT DEBATE. Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
This message is a reply to: | | Message 61 by WS-JW, posted 06-10-2007 3:17 AM | | WS-JW has not replied |
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Re: disjunction can be continuous in discontinuous space
Brad, I'm not clear how QM relates to this, this is thermodynamics, right? If so, it comes under the heading "environment".
are you fully for reductionism or not? Not really. It's like a tomato grower needing to know the values of the five forces in order to give his plants the right nutrients. Ultimately some or all of the main forces are involved, it just isn't necessary to know them in order to feed tomato plants. Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Re: Re:Thermodynamics, evolution and QM
Brad, In laymens terms what does this mean? Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
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mark24
Member (Idle past 5225 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: 12-01-2001
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Message 80 of 107 (406756)
06-22-2007 8:07 AM
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Reply to: Message 78 by jaywill 06-22-2007 7:18 AM
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Re: Processes
jaywill,
If SETI researchers have this freedom why do you want to nip ID in the bud before they have opportunity to speculate pro and con? They've had thousands of years, & still nada. Mark
There are 10 kinds of people in this world; those that understand binary, & those that don't
This message is a reply to: | | Message 78 by jaywill, posted 06-22-2007 7:18 AM | | jaywill has not replied |
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