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Author Topic:   A Genesis Day and the Age of the Earth: what does the Bible say?
doctrbill
Member (Idle past 2795 days)
Posts: 1174
From: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Joined: 01-08-2001


Message 25 of 35 (479416)
08-27-2008 2:02 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Bambootiger
08-24-2008 7:14 PM


The REST of the Story
Bambootiger writes:
... day 7 did not have an end. Since it is a reasonable conclusion that he days of the creation account are of equal length, we can gain understanding of the issue of the length of the creative days by considering the length of the seventh day. At Hebrews 4:1-10, Paul quotes from Psalm 95:11 to demonstrate that the Israelites of Moses' day had the opportunity to enter into God's day of rest, but these failed to do so because of their lack of faith, and disobedience, and he then indicates that Christians of his time still had the opportunity to do so because that seventh day was still continuing. So the conclusion this leads to is that the seventh day is thousands of years long and thus the other days would be as long also.
God's Day of Rest?
Let's see if your Bible study rings true to the purpose of your argument. I prefer to begin with the Old Testament quotes and work forward.
quote:
Harden not your heart, as in the provocation, [and] as [in] the day of temptation in the wilderness: When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my work. Forty years long was I grieved with [this] generation, and said, It [is] a people that do err in their heart, and they have not known my ways: Unto whom I sware in my wrath that they should not enter into my rest. Psalm 95:8-11 KJV
One rather telling rendition of verse 11 which I like because it is true to the context (the entry into Canaan) reads:
quote:
So in my anger I made a vow: `They will never enter my place of rest.' " Psalm 95:11 New Living Translation (NLT)
The "rest" i.e. "place of rest" being the promised land.
Now let us turn to what Paul is on about. I am going to continue with the NLT because it reads so easily by comparison.
quote:
And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn't it the people who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? And to whom was God speaking when he vowed that they would never enter his place of rest? He was speaking to those who disobeyed him. So we see that they were not allowed to enter his rest because of their unbelief. Hebrews 3:17-19 NLT
They were killed, or allowed to die, so they would not enter into "the rest" AKA "place of rest" AKA Promised Land.
Paul goes on to draw a spiritual lesson from that wilderness experience, comparing the then modern Jews to those ancient ones, and faith in Moses, to faith in Jesus. The previous "rest" was a piece of ground, the very land of promise. Now, however, the "rest" is something else, something more spiritual, less tangible but none-the-less desirable. Even now, says Paul, it awaits the people of God.
quote:
We know it is ready because the Scriptures mention the seventh day, saying, "On the seventh day God rested from all his work." But in the other passage God said, "They will never enter my place of rest." So God's rest is there for people to enter. But those who formerly heard the Good News failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his place of rest, and that time is today. God announced this through David a long time later in the words already quoted: "Today you must listen to his voice. Don't harden your hearts against him." This new place of rest was not the land of Canaan, where Joshua led them. If it had been, God would not have spoken later about another day of rest. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who enter into God's rest will find rest from their labors, just as God rested after creating the world. Let us do our best to enter that place of rest. For anyone who disobeys God, as the people of Israel did, will fall. Hebrew 4:4-11 NLT
Note the expressions: "new place of rest" (described as different from the first); and "special rest" (which awaits the people of God); and "another dayof rest" different from the first. Note Paul's use of the past tense: "God rested," rather than the present tense which, if that day is ongoing, should read: "God is resting."
This is clearly NOT about God having ceased his creative activity. If you doubt that, you can actually look at the universe and see that he continues to be rather busy.
This is clearly about obedience to God, being in harmony with his will, the reward for which is - a "place of rest" - "still waiting for the people of God."
I believe your hypothesis has just lost a leg.
They shoot horses, don't they?

Theology is the science of Dominion.
- - - My God is your god's Boss - - -

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Bambootiger, posted 08-24-2008 7:14 PM Bambootiger has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 28 by Bambootiger, posted 08-27-2008 6:29 AM doctrbill has replied

doctrbill
Member (Idle past 2795 days)
Posts: 1174
From: Eugene, Oregon, USA
Joined: 01-08-2001


Message 31 of 35 (479465)
08-27-2008 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Bambootiger
08-27-2008 6:29 AM


The REST of the Story
I wish I could say you have an hypothesis going but I'm afraid that is not the case.
I have other problems with your OP but chose this one because no one had yet touched it.
Bambootiger writes:
... the conclusion this leads to is that the seventh day is thousands of years long and thus the other days would be as long also.
You seem to think it significant that the Scripture does not specifically say, "Day Seven Ended."
Is it not enough that it says: God rested and was refreshed?
quote:
For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, but he rested on the seventh day and was refreshed." Exodus 31:17 NLT
Notice the past tense. If what you propose were true then it should read: God is resting (present tense) and will be refreshed (future tense).
Their rest was in the promised land, but the land inself was not that rest.
That seems reasonable.
It is also reasonable for the NLT to give "rest" {menukah (H4496)} as "place of rest" in this circumstance; for it fits the context and is translated that way in other places by the KJV:
quote:
... the ark of the covenant of the LORD went before them ... to search out a resting place for them. Numbers 10:33
... my people shall dwell in a peaceable habitation, and in sure dwellings, and in quiet resting places; Isa 32:17,18
Note the poetic parallelisms: "peacable habitation" - "sure dwellings" - "quiet resting places."
Bambootiger writes:
As for where that rest is read Matthew 5:5 where Jesus was quoting from Psalms 37. Thar is our promised land now.
quote:
... the meek shall inherit the earth; and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace. Psa 37:11
First you say the "rest" was NOT about the land, then you suggest that it IS about the land: the entire "earth."
I am confused. You want this "rest" to be a chronological argument regarding the age of the earth. You also want it as a reward given to the faithful; a huge piece of real estate: an entire planet. On the other hand, you want the spiritual interpretation which Paul gives it: blessings enjoyed by those who "Become reconciled to God." The image this brings to my mind is: eons of unemployment benefits while hanging out with God until he decides to go back to work!
That's probably not what you wanted me to think. Yes?
Your campaign has been valiant and I would give you an 'A' for effort but so far I see no evidence nor logical progression which would lead me to your conclusion. Your premise regarding Ferris Bueller's God's Day Off does not appear to be supported by the textual materials which you have provided and I know of no other which might be put to the task. I find it odd that you think God is somehow on holiday and that you think the length of God's holiday can determine the length of the days of creation week. I also think it odd that you imagine "God's rest" in terms of real estate; how it was once in the land of Canaan but now encompasses "the earth." I also wonder what you think it means to have God "resting" from his work. Would that explain the presence of evil in the world?
Yes. This leg is definately broken.

Theology is the science of Dominion.
- - - My God is your god's Boss - - -

This message is a reply to:
 Message 28 by Bambootiger, posted 08-27-2008 6:29 AM Bambootiger has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by Bambootiger, posted 08-28-2008 12:01 AM doctrbill has not replied

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