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Missing Matter

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Author Topic:   Missing Matter
onifre
Member (Idle past 2980 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 53 of 104 (485552)
10-09-2008 12:24 PM 		Reply to: Message 52 by Agobot
10-09-2008 10:41 AM

Re: Thanks to both Son and Cave
Agobot writes:
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Why do scientists try to use General Relativity at the Singularity?
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It's not that they are trying to apply it to the singularity, it's that using GR the equations break down into a singularity.
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The way i see it is this - prior to the BB there was nothing physical, just energy. After the BB there is still nothing physical, just energy and thus nothing arose of nothing and something did not arise of nothing.
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And there will always be energy. However, our reality is one of a physical matter, and thus can be explained by physics.
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There was just an enormously dense enegy prior to the BB that has since then spread out considerably.
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That is what GR tells us about T=O, the equations breaks down into infinite density, temperature, and curvature. But, thats not the only theory. Like we were talking about on Bertot's thread, the No-Boundary proposal introduces a no-boundary unviverse that does not require a BB singularity; since the universe has no boundaries there is no starting point. It would be like trying to explain to me at what point on the Earths surface does the Earth begin.
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But, there are other theories as well, Loop QM also has no singularity in it's equation nor will any unifying theory. So it's a bit premature, IMO, to say for certain what conditions were like before the BB, because for all we know there was no beginning point.
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Why would we try to apply physical laws from our classical world to an energy point with no physical dimensions?
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The universe works within a frame of physical laws Abogot, I think you are well aware of that. We humans have been able to understand most of it. Our reality is of a physical nature and if we are the one's trying to explain the origin of the universe we must use a system that we can work with...like physical laws. We are just doing our best to explain. Don't get so cynical.
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"All great truths begin as blasphemies"
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"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
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"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by Agobot, posted 10-09-2008 10:41 AM Agobot has replied
Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Agobot, posted 10-09-2008 12:52 PM onifre has replied
  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2980 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008

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Message 55 of 104 (485554)
10-09-2008 1:00 PM 		Reply to: Message 54 by Agobot
10-09-2008 12:52 PM

Re: Thanks to both Son and Cave
Bogot writes:
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How is a singularity part of our reality?
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They are not, thats the need for the unifying theory. We should be able to explain everything with physical laws. A singularity is unsatisfactory and as such needs to be removed.
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They simply don't belong in my realm of existence.
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Neither in mine. A unifying theory will remove the singularity, but I should say also that in your realm of reality, which is to say today at T=Now, there is no singularity, so your realm of reality is unaffected by what happened 14 Bya. It would just be in a physics equation where reality breaks down, not in reality.
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"All great truths begin as blasphemies"
​
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
​
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky
This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Agobot, posted 10-09-2008 12:52 PM Agobot has not replied
  
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