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Author Topic:   Corporate Personhood
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 88 of 93 (638658)
10-24-2011 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by Bailey
10-23-2011 11:30 PM


Re: Not personhood, corporathood
ot only is it totally foreign to the idea's established within the Constitution to conceive a citizen of the United States who is not a citizen of some one of the states, it's completely inconsistent with the proper construction and common understanding of the expression as used in the Constitution.
Presumably you mean inconsistent with the Constitution prior to the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment. The Fourteenth Amendment explicitly defines who is a citizen; our current Constitution does not require citizenship in any state as a prerequisite for US citizenship.
As Dr. A points out, DC residents are U.S. Citizens who clearly are not a citizen or resident of any state.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by Bailey, posted 10-23-2011 11:30 PM Bailey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by Bailey, posted 10-24-2011 8:21 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 91 of 93 (639342)
10-30-2011 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by Bailey
10-24-2011 8:21 PM


Re: Not personhood, corporathood
I don’t disagree with a thing you’ve presented NoNukes, and perhaps like you, I’ve yet to see anyone at all suggest that a Federal ‘U.S. citizen’ was recognized within the original vision of the Constitution.
I think Dred Scott made it abundantly clear that such was not the case. But we don't live with the Constitution as it existed prior to 1865 and I don't pine for those good old days. I've heard pundits raving about how democratic this country was in the 1830s, but in my opinion those pundits are idiots.
We've done the experiment, and the original definition of citizenship was an abysmal failure. The original constitution had a lot of baggage in it, much of which was cleaned up with the 14th Amendment. And yet some fools want to remove it, or tinker with it in ways that could disenfranchise large groups of citizens.
In the end we all seem to agree they’re a later creation, gaining legal form and function through Amendments to the original document..
Yeah, and...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by Bailey, posted 10-24-2011 8:21 PM Bailey has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 92 by Bailey, posted 11-04-2011 3:16 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 93 of 93 (640679)
11-11-2011 4:11 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by Bailey
11-04-2011 3:16 PM


Re: Natural People as Property vs. Artificial People as Citizens
The experiment’s obviously not over. The failure of the definition of American citizenship was imminent given the racist slant imbued within the original definition of ‘people’ - you know that. The Constitution still has a lot of baggage, as that’s what political documents are comprised of, and the 14th amendment doesn’t change that, but rather contributes to it.
I don't see how the 14th Amendment contributed to the explicit racial Constitutional baggage that existed prior to ratification. Amendments 13-15 explicitly repealed most of it. While it is true that doing so did not result in full equality and the end of racism, I don't see anything in the Constitution that still mandated that stuff.

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 Message 92 by Bailey, posted 11-04-2011 3:16 PM Bailey has not replied

  
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