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Author Topic:   Difference between religion and science fora
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 30 of 81 (228421)
08-01-2005 11:09 AM
Reply to: Message 26 by Faith
08-01-2005 9:30 AM


Re: Terminology
Faith
You have been told many, many times that one of the hallmarks of science is Tentativity. To now pretend that you do not know that says one of two things.
Either you are incapable of learning or you are simply refusing to acknowledge what you have been told.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 26 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 9:30 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 11:37 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 32 of 81 (228434)
08-01-2005 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 31 by Faith
08-01-2005 11:37 AM


Re: Terminology
Yes, you might say that. LOL
There are no terms showing degrees of tentativity that I know of. There is the body of evidence that supports each conclusion.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 11:37 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by Wounded King, posted 08-01-2005 11:57 AM jar has not replied
 Message 34 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 12:05 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 36 of 81 (228457)
08-01-2005 12:33 PM
Reply to: Message 34 by Faith
08-01-2005 12:05 PM


Re: Terminology
There is an area of mathematics called Proof. For example, there are proofs in geometry. There the term can be validly used.
There are some things that are so well supported that they may be considered as very, very close to being proven. Evolution is one such as is the fact of an old universe. While it is possible that either of those might be wrong, the universe could have been created yesterday, the likelyhood is so low that most people simply disregard such considerations.
You can use the general tem proof or proved as long as it is with the understanding that it really is held tentatively.
It is possible that evolution did not happen.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 34 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 12:05 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 38 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 12:41 PM jar has not replied
 Message 39 by nator, posted 08-01-2005 12:42 PM jar has not replied
 Message 45 by randman, posted 08-01-2005 1:03 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 49 of 81 (228486)
08-01-2005 1:17 PM
Reply to: Message 45 by randman
08-01-2005 1:03 PM


Re: Terminology
The evidence for evolution is a FACT. The Evolution happened is still tentative but so well supported that it is as close to being proved as anything known. The Theory of Evolution is held tentatively but it is the best explanation available. However it is possibly the best supported theory in science.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 45 by randman, posted 08-01-2005 1:03 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by randman, posted 08-01-2005 1:41 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 53 of 81 (228509)
08-01-2005 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by randman
08-01-2005 1:41 PM


Re: Terminology
Well so far in other threads you have not been able to convice folk that any of those things were ever taught as facts.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by randman, posted 08-01-2005 1:41 PM randman has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 2:22 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 423 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 55 of 81 (228524)
08-01-2005 2:44 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by Faith
08-01-2005 2:22 PM


Re: Terminology
Well, let's look at them.
I must admit that my education was some time ago, but I can say that those were not actually what I was taught. In addition, they are for the most part just nonsense statements.
1. Neaderthal was ape-like and not at the level of modern humans, the impression is that he could not, for instance, have mated with people.
What does that statement mean? I was taught that Neaderthal lived in communities, likely had fire, made tools, seemed to have some belief structure, took care of injured members of the community. The question of mating was open and unresolved.
So the only reasonable conclusion is that randman is simply talking nonsense.
2. Cro-Magnon man was a missing link. Actually, I don't see any bioligical differences between Cro-Magnon and us except that Cro-Magnons were typically taller.
Again, that was simply not what I was taught. In fact, I cannot remember the question of a missing link even coming up except as a joke. The second sentence is simply randman stating that he is incredulous. Hardly evidence.
3. Haeckel's drawings.
4. the phylotypic stage in embryos
5. fish gills in human embryos
A whole thread has been devoted to that issue.
6. Fossils documenting evolution which was the very gradual change from one species to another (false impression since fossil record does not show that)
Again, a mistatement. There are many examples of fossils that show gradual change. One good example is the changes in shellfish over time. There are also examples of rapid change. There is no reason that both cannot happen simultaneously.
7. Micro-evolution proves ToE
IMHO, kinda. It is certainly one of the things that support the TOE but as you have been told, there is a difference between the TOE and evolution. Science also hold tentativity as a basic tenet. That makes his assertion only yet another of his many unsupported and incorrect assertions.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by Faith, posted 08-01-2005 2:22 PM Faith has not replied

  
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