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Author | Topic: What you want to know about Christ. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Hoot mon writes: I would like to know if Jesus was genetically diploid or haploid. Ron Wyatt supposedly found a sample of Jesus' blood. You might be interested in this thread. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
itrownot writes: This may seem to you an insignificant issue, but to me it is actually more "unscriptural" than not, since "born-agains" ARE instructed in 1st Corinthians (and, admittedly, I'm paraphrasing somewhat) not to be "of Paul", "of Apollos", "of Cephas", and, most strikingly, it seems, "of Christ." quote: I don't see it saying we shouldn't be "of Christ". “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
itrownot writes: Nowhere within the passage (1Cor, chapter 1)does he say, "Therefore let everyone declare himself to be "of Christ" for the sake of unity, or whatever; on the contrary, he simply focuses on the power of the preaching of the cross. You quoted it yourself: "He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.", not "glory in the cross." Paul was telling the Corinthians (and by extension, us) not to follow Paul or Apollos or Cephas, but to follow Christ. Hence, we should not call ourselves Paulines, Apollosines, Cephasites or Crucians - but Christians.
In other words, he concentrates on "what we should do" and turns away from "who we are" as the operative question of the hour. I agree with that.
... "what they ought to be be doing," namely, "preaching Christ and him crucified." What they ought to be doing is doing, not preaching. But this topic was intended for gen to enlighten us, not for me to enlighten you. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
itrownot writes: Therefore, my point remains that it is not "what" one ought to call himself/herself, but rather that one ought to shun the label itself in prefernce to getting about the actual business of doing.... There's a difference between right labels and wrong labels. Paul was pointing out that wrong labels like "Pauline", "Apollosine" and "Cephasite" indicate wrong thinking. There's also a difference between not labelling oneself and "shunning the label". I only pointed out that you are embellishing the text. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
itrownot writes: Those "of Christ" simply are not given any preferential treatment.... They certainly are.
quote: Christ was crucified for you and ye are bapized in the name of Christ. The name of Christ most definitely is singled out from the list.
... when one purports to be "of Christ," this is at best a potentially hazardous presumption, and therefore of dubious merit. I agree, but "potentially hazardous" and "of dubious merit" are not the same as shunning the label. It's good to be humble but going too far in the shunning direction can amount to denying Christ.
Furthermore, Paul makes no ensuing effort to amend the text to be more amiable toward those claiming to be "of Christ." Nor does he need to. He is only eliminating those we should not follow.
Moreover, I myself find nothing as yet, biblically speaking, that enjoins anyone to take on the name "Christian." Neither do I. I'm not saying we should take the name "Christian". (If you read a few thousand of my posts, you'll find that I don't.) I'm saying that we shouldn't shun it either, like Peter did.
Finally, IMO, you are merely splitting hairs between "shunning a label" and "not taking on a label." Personally I fail to see the need for such a minor distinction to be drawn.... Get used to it. This isn't choir practise. Don't expect anything you say here to go unexamined. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
itrownot writes: Sure, you may decide to declare victory after a fashion, but so what? I haven't declared any victory. I've shown where (I think) you're wrong. Anybody reading this can make up their own minds whose point is stronger - which is why it's important to lay it out very precisely for them. If you don't want to communicate with your audience, you're just wearing out your keyboard for nothing.
I'm interested in more quality of conversation thatn that, frankly, and you might well get used to that from me as well, I suppose. You're welcome to show some quality on your end. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
gen writes: Actually, if you are willing to answer some of the questions in a loving manner according to the Bible.... You probably wouldn't like most of my answers. For example:
Are you a Christian/born again/follower of Jesus yourself? I don't like the term "born again", because most professing Christians have no clue what it means. And I'm not much of a follower. I strain at the leash. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
iano writes: Consider the gospel to be a tool. I bring it to the site - the Holy Spirit works it. So you're the Holy Spirit's caddy? Wouldn't it make more sense for His protege to demonstrate the product? “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
iano writes: ... people don't "interpret" their reality - they just assume their reality is the case. That's not true, of course. People compare their "reality" with other people's personal perceptions to make a composite "collective reality". Rational thinking depends on being able to show reasons for your conclusion. Showing reason depends on being able to communicate your perceptions to others.
don't err in supposing that empiricism verifies reality. Empiricism doesn't "verify reality". It fine-tunes our perception of reality. What people are asking you, I think, is why you trust your own perception of reality over the collective perception of everybody else. When one person has a "reality" that differs substantially from the collective perception, we call that mental illness. I don't think you've shown how your perception of reality (with respect to "spritual" experiences) differs from mental illness. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
iano writes: Presumably these people of yours first assume their reality to be the case. They would need to do that in order to be sure that the other people they are comparing themselves with actually exist. Yes. We, as a society, do assume (if you want to call it an assumption) that people exist. We also assume that experiences can be communicated between people by way of evidence. We also assume that the experiences are "less real" if they can not be verified by evidence.
quote: Fine so long as fine-tuning is not necessarily taken as moving our perceptions any closer to the actual reality. Empiricism doesn't "move our perceptions". It takes our conclusions closer to the best approximation of "actual reality" that we can ever know.
Given the amount of people on the world who have one or other spiritual outlook (and thus perception of reality) I wonder who forms your "collective perceptionists". That smells like a false dichotomy - spiritual outlook or no spiritual outlook. The fact is that people with almost any spiritual outlook can subscribe to and contribute to the collective knowledge of reality. It isn't spiritual versus non-spiritual. It's rational versus irrational. “Faith moves mountains, but only knowledge moves them to the right place” -- Joseph Goebbels ------------- Help scientific research in your spare time. No cost. No obligation. Join the World Community Grid with Team EvC
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