The experience of converting

You stated:"A fundamentalist Christian believes in the truth of her religion, also not by faith -- her evidence is the subjective religious feelings that she experiences. I don't think it's very good evidence, but it's evidence nonetheless."Most fundy's continue to cite the bible as proof itself.

Is that Jesus's fault, or just dumb people?

Before someone could blame Jesus, they first would have to demonstrate that the historical Jesus actually existed. Before the second Jewish revolt , there was no non-scriptural evidence this person existed. Come to think of it, many if not most of the gospels were written after the second Jewish revolt.

I should also note that I used the word "evil" as a relative term to my standard of moral codes. This reminds me of a movie I recently saw. Wil Smith starring in 'I, Robot'.The three laws are perfect, yet there can only be one logical conclusion that can be drawn from them. I'm not going to spoil the movie, so if you want to know what I'm talking about but haven't seen the movie, just go out and rent it.2 good doesn't always result in an ultimate good.Added by edit:Oh yeah, one more thing. My love for my fellow humans are too great now for me to become a christian.This message has been edited by GAW-Snow, 07-21-2005 12:46 PM

Do you consider yourself to be dumb, rat? Because according to my moral standard, you are awefully close to being evil... at least your opinions so far on these boards.Heck, I have a friend who is currently on a mission trip. That in itself I consider evil.I'll tell you this much, he is a very devout christian who believes just about the opposite of what I believe in almost every subject. Sure he believes that stealing is wrong, but his christian values doesn't prevent him from believing that stealing from my tax dollars is wrong. I'll tell you this much right now. He just stole 200 dollars of my tax dollars.Just because it's not green doesn't mean it's not money!

Well yea, but so does a "moral code". I guess thats why we are human.Yes, I saw the movie, but I see no relation to being Christian. That statment is just so condratictory.So your saying that to become Christian, you would have to stop loving people?It's pretty clear that you do not like the people you define as "Christian"

if i recall, they weren't actually following the three laws. whether or not they covered it in the movie, their logic is basically something called the "zeroth law." like the 1st law (harm no human) takes precedence over the 2nd (obey orders), the 0th takes precedence over the 1st.so they could actually break the 1st law, if the 0th required it, in their opinions. i think in the movie, the 0th law actually came from their interpretations -- not a human designer -- so it was technically breaking the laws they were programmed to follow.this would be like us reasoning that "love thy neighbor" being the ultimate goal, we should actually kill off everyone we hate so that it's possible. it's not exactly aligned with the spirit of the law.

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Hi notwise,I am an athiest and have been for many years now. I went to Sunday school and church in a protestant congregation my entire youth and young adulthood, I know all the Bible stories and sang "Jesus Loves Me", was baptized. It wasn't a fundamentalist church or anything, no "fire and brimstone" preaching, people were nice, I had friends there.I think that just somewhere along the way of going to Sunday school and church every Sunday, (and then youth group meetings Sunday night) I just started to think that some of what I was hearing wasn't quite right. I started thinking about why people would or wouldn't go to hell. Such as, a Bhuddist monk who lived in harmony with the world and had never harmed a living thing, got a ticket straight to hell because he wasn't a Christian. To me that didn't seem too fair, and I felt that God oughta be fair.I think I can trace my first glimmerings of doubt in religion and God back to a single incident, which I bet people remember. Sometime in my pre-teen years, National Geographic ran a TV special about seal hunts, where the hunters would club baby seals to death. I was really shaken by seeing that, and when I went to bed that night, I prayed for it to stop. In my life I do not think I have ever really prayed for anything else. I mean, how could a nice guy God let something like this happen. So I think this event kind of opened up my thinking and questioning. Until some years later, I just sort of realized that I was still going to church, mainly to make my mom happy, but that I didn't believe any of it.And then you throw science and a few religious whackos like Jerry Falwell into the mix to re-affirm what I thought was going on, and here I am.I think it all started with a pretty truamatic event, but then it was a very gradual move, until one day I just realized. Oddly enough, one of my best friends who attended that same church, has turned out just like me. Go figure.

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Men have nipples. Adam was the first man, created by God in His image. Why does God have nipples?

I love my fellow human beings too much to destroy their cultures, takes rights away from the, etc.

I agree. Is it possible to teach people from other cultures about Jesus, and yet keep their own culture. Can't they worship God in their own way?
Isn't it for them to decide, should we deny them a choice?
Or is this Star Trek, and we have to keep the prime directive?
Should we not share medical advances with them also?
Keep in mind that not every musslim might believe in God either.

How can you be a muslim and not believe in God?This message has been edited by Charles Knight, 23-Jul-2005 07:54 AM

What is it to believe, what's in a word?
In a world where you can be killed for being a Christian, or any other multitude of reasons, tell you think this is not possible.

Could you translate that into english?Oh and if this gets released in the states, this could be up your street:http://tinyurl.com/8o38hThis message has been edited by Charles Knight, 24-Jul-2005 08:10 AM

It might be a good movie, I haven't seen it and I won't. Instead I would like to recommend the book(s) by Asimov. They were really good. The 3 laws are a set of priorities and were a kind of logic. These laws of Asimov were hinted at in 2001 when HAL goes insane because of conflicts in it's programming.lfen

i protested it while it was in the theatres. however, since i used to get free movies it didn't hurt my conscience much to watch it. it wasn't the atrocity i expected.

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