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Author Topic:   Why read the Bible literally: take two
DorfMan
Member (Idle past 6110 days)
Posts: 282
From: New York
Joined: 09-08-2005


Message 183 of 306 (241347)
09-08-2005 1:01 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Brian
06-27-2005 3:22 PM


Re: Tenatively Rejected
I think that stealing, killing, messing with someone else's spouse, etc., are not good things and should not be done. The admonition to refrain from any practices that does harm to fellow creatures, should be taken literally. The first four commandments deal with a Christian's relationship with God. Those can be ignored by the non-believer. The last six commandments, however, should be taken literally by everyone, even tho you may not covet your neighbors ass, the ass is just an example. You may covet something else your neighbor has.
Breaking those six/ten simple rules is basically the foundation of all evil.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Brian, posted 06-27-2005 3:22 PM Brian has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by Rahvin, posted 09-08-2005 1:31 PM DorfMan has replied

DorfMan
Member (Idle past 6110 days)
Posts: 282
From: New York
Joined: 09-08-2005


Message 186 of 306 (241804)
09-09-2005 12:25 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by Rahvin
09-08-2005 1:31 PM


Re: Tenatively Rejected
It all seems very clear to you.
Except for one thing. Society picks up the tab for the ills that plague humanity, and you listed the ills. Theft, lies, adultery, coveting, dishonoring parents, killing. No one, not even God, forces good behavior on anyone. Such things are chosen freely. Choose incorrectly, and penalties happen. How sad a life lives the coveter who squanders paycheck after paycheck, because he/she cannot control buying things. How sad the adulterer, who lives with guilt, or the child that lives with neglecting its parents, and so on.
The right to be assholes comes with penalties. Have a go and see what happens.
As for 'love thy neighbor as thyself'? If you take a careful look at those six ideals, you will see that this maxim includes all of them.
Thank you for your thoughts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by Rahvin, posted 09-08-2005 1:31 PM Rahvin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 187 by Rahvin, posted 09-09-2005 1:36 PM DorfMan has replied

DorfMan
Member (Idle past 6110 days)
Posts: 282
From: New York
Joined: 09-08-2005


Message 209 of 306 (242479)
09-12-2005 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 187 by Rahvin
09-09-2005 1:36 PM


Re: Tenatively Rejected
But you missed my entire point.
The advice of those Commandments are an excellent quide to having a better society, and living a better life in general. But forcing the ideas on non-believers is immoral.
>>>>>>>>>>>
Your reply is contradictory. Many, if not all of these adages are forced on society through secular laws. If you reflect, then you will see how they are applied prodigiously. Not-believers are most likely also inclinded to live a law-abiding life. I've not encountered a single one who came up with better guidelines than the ones in question.<<<<<<<<<
>>>>>>>>>
If I misunderstood, and you only believe that the ideas they represent and propose should be taken to heart by everyone as a guide to a better life and society, then I agree and apoligize for misunderstanding.>>>>>>
Upon reflecting, I believe you understand that no force is applied by Christians and society has the right to make and enforce laws for the well-being of all its citizens.
No apology necessary. There are some Christians that are other things before they are Christians. By their deeds you will know them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Rahvin, posted 09-09-2005 1:36 PM Rahvin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 210 by Rahvin, posted 09-12-2005 12:12 PM DorfMan has replied

DorfMan
Member (Idle past 6110 days)
Posts: 282
From: New York
Joined: 09-08-2005


Message 229 of 306 (243309)
09-14-2005 11:27 AM
Reply to: Message 210 by Rahvin
09-12-2005 12:12 PM


Re: Tenatively Rejected
The advice of those Commandments are an excellent quide to having a better society, and living a better life in general. But forcing the ideas on non-believers is immoral.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I find this contradictory. Perhaps it isn't. I stumbled over the words excellent/forcing/immoral. I don't see any of this happening, although I know it would, if - what calls itself Christian - had the opportunity.
That is why this country must never be a theocracy and all Christians should do all to prevent this event. Personally, the thought horrifies me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
No laws against adultery, yet adultery is a legitimate cause for divorce.
False witness - you have addressed it - and also lying under oath, on applications, and many other instances. False witness is lying.
Coveting may and can lead to many acts against humanity, to stealing, lying, killing. Coveting is, therefore, covered in many laws that are not immediately plain. Does the drug dealer covet?
I, personally, believe that basic human rights are well-protected within the framework of the commandments. It is just unpleasant for many to acknowledge and I have no problem with that. I see it as such, you do not see it as such. There is much animosity against that which calls itself Christian. If I understand nothing else, I understand this completely. Under the cloak of Christianity, many ills have been perpetrated against human beings, leaving a permanent misunderstanding of who Christ is. Most people stop right here and do not comment on the good things done in Christ's name.
I think we agree, especially on the thoughts that Christianity must not be enforced. Sadly, there are those who would and have a history of doing so and have not given up trying.
Enforcing religion is not a new thing and not indigenous to Christianity. It has been around forever, and is around still and still kills and oppresses.
Thank you for your thoughts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 210 by Rahvin, posted 09-12-2005 12:12 PM Rahvin has not replied

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