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Author Topic:   Evolution != Atheism (re: the Rejection of Theism in Evolution)
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3941 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 61 of 178 (173499)
01-03-2005 3:54 PM
Reply to: Message 60 by macaroniandcheese
01-03-2005 3:07 PM


Re: Evolution vs. creation
How so?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 60 by macaroniandcheese, posted 01-03-2005 3:07 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3941 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 77 of 178 (175006)
01-08-2005 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 76 by Tal
01-08-2005 9:41 AM


Drift
I am afraid that this topic is drifting. Lets please stick to the OP.

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 Message 76 by Tal, posted 01-08-2005 9:41 AM Tal has replied

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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3941 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 92 of 178 (175871)
01-11-2005 12:41 PM


Topic Please
As interesting as all of this is can we not bring down the Admin's wrath on my topic. I don't want to abandon the hope of the OP spawning an actual on topic discussion just yet.
If it is not related to the the rejection of Theistic Evolutionism by Biblical Creationists then please kindly start a new topic.

  
Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3941 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 96 of 178 (176536)
01-13-2005 12:08 PM
Reply to: Message 95 by PurpleYouko
01-13-2005 9:18 AM


Re: Evolution vs. creation
I am going to agree with you on the focus of the topic. It is possible to have a belief in "a god" and rationalize that belief with evolution. This thread in particular is asking why do some people, Biblical Creationists in particular, reject the ability for their fellow believers to accept evolution. Another type of belief system, while interesting, isn't necessarily being disputed by a specific group of people. Theistic evolution is being disputed either directly or indirectly by the quotes I listed in my OP.
The way I see it, you weigh up the evidence for both sides and see where you come out. The Christian, Creationist God is either Guilty of creating life, the universe and everything or he isn't. There is no grey area here. No room for finding the universe or coming from outside of it or any number of other god ideas.
This I am going to go ahead and disagree with. Most Theistic Evolutionists I know take Genesis and other parts of the OT as very much a borrowed mythology. While it may have some spiritual signifigance, it is no way is an accurate description of creation or God's role in creation. Given that it is our only insight into creation given in the Bible, it is only speculation as to how much God was or was not involved with the different aspects of creation. Personally, I believe that God created the entire universe with all of its properties which includes free will for the life and matter therein. I believe that God can intervene on our behalf when he wishes but for the most part lets us exercise the gift of our free will as he has given it to us.
You seem to be saying that I am forced to believe that God did it all or that there is no God. Why is this so? Given that we can point to Genesis and show its borrowed nature why should Christians be forced to have ANY particular view on the creation event whatever it was. So what if I believe that God is an entity that exists within the universe or is the universe or is outside the universe in some kind of cloudy extra dimension. The criteria for being a Christian is believing that God, from wherever he exists, came down and decided to be a man in order to save us from our sins.
Now. How can we get Biblical/Genesis Creationists to stop demeaning their other brothers and sisters in Christ who don't believe that Genesis was written by the hand of God?

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 Message 95 by PurpleYouko, posted 01-13-2005 9:18 AM PurpleYouko has replied

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Jazzns
Member (Idle past 3941 days)
Posts: 2657
From: A Better America
Joined: 07-23-2004


Message 98 of 178 (176564)
01-13-2005 1:33 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by PurpleYouko
01-13-2005 12:19 PM


Re: Evolution vs. creation
I always thought of the bible (OT and NT) as being indivisable. If you freely admit that bits of it aren't correct then how can you tell which bits are? Is it just a matter of picking and choosing whit bits you like and which bits you don't?. Who makes that call? Each person themselves or some higher religious leader?
I try to use healthy skepticism when it comes to the Bible. If there is a particular book of the Bible that history shows to be a borrowed myth from another culture then I have reason to be skeptical of that book.
Basically everything has to stand up on its own. For a lot of the Bible I have no reason to reject or affirm it based on the history that I know so I make up my own mind about it. I don't pick and choose because if I did there would be a whole bunch of stuff that I would toss out that I do not necessarily like. Children often do not like the rules of their parents but they still (hopefully mostly) follow them.
There is good reason to doubt Genesis which is why I do. People can splice it up however they like but the creation and the flood are both borrowed myths with a twist. It takes quite a huge mental contortion to not acknowledge the similarities to other mythologies that pre-date the Bible and that they are not 2, often contradictory, stories of both the creation event and the flood. I simply take Genesis for what it is; a historically innacurate mythology maintained in the Bible for historical reasons.

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