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Author | Topic: What I have noticed about these debates... | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Mammuthus Member (Idle past 6503 days) Posts: 3085 From: Munich, Germany Joined: |
quote: Cool link schrafinator...I had seen some of the individual polls but not the various polls combined. [Fixed quoting. --Admin] [This message has been edited by Admin, 12-05-2002]
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nator Member (Idle past 2198 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
None of the people on your list who are dead, which are most of them, count, because they can't have evaluated the 100 or so years of evidence-gathering that has gone on since theiy departed the scene.
Chandra Wickramasinghe is not a Creationist. There was a court case in which he was called to sestify about evolution... From the court proceedings transcript: McLean v. Arkansas Board of Education "The Court is at a loss to understand why Dr. Wickramasinghe was called in behalf of the defendants. Perhaps it was because he was generally critical of the theory of evolution and the scientific community, a tactic consistent with the strategy of the defense. Unfortunately for the defense, he demonstrated that the simplistic approach of the two model analysis of the origins of life is false. Furthermore, he corroborated the plaintiffs' witnesses by concluding that "no rational scientist" would believe the earth's geology could be explained by reference to a worldwide flood or that the earth was less than one million years old."
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nator Member (Idle past 2198 days) Posts: 12961 From: Ann Arbor Joined: |
quote: Thanks! It's been very useful. [Fixed quoting. --Admin] [This message has been edited by Admin, 12-05-2002]
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Percy Member Posts: 22502 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 4.9 |
Are these the stats you were referring to? I had to poke around the site a bit before finding them at Beliefs of the U.S. public about evolution and creation:
1997-NOV data is little changed. Note the massive differences between the beliefs of the general population and of scientists:
If one assumes that increased education correlates with increased knowledge, then this information appears to indicate that the less you know the more likely you are to accept Creationism. While I have no sources in front of me, my recollection is that similar correlations have been found between educational levels and the acceptance of other forms of pseudo-science like mind-reading, UFOs, communication with the dead, etc. --Percy
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wj Inactive Member |
Another interesting trend identified in the data at that site is how the US contrasts with other countries. For example, 35% of US accept evolution compared with 66% in New Zealand, 76% in Great Britain, 65% in Italy and 61% in Philippines.
The full table is at Comparing Christian beliefs in U.S. with those of other countries Unfortunately the figure for Australia isn't included but I suspect it would fall within the New Zealand - Great Britain range. Doesn't it seem strange that the US shares such low acceptance of evolution with such countries as Poland and Russia?
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mark24 Member (Idle past 5223 days) Posts: 3857 From: UK Joined: |
wj,
Interestingly, GB & East Germany (showing the studies age) have the highest % acceptance of evolution AND at the same time the lowest % belief in the bible. Yet the correlation to a belief in God doesn't seem to follow. It's the bible & evolution, not religion & evolution that appear to be the oil & water, a gross generalisation I confess. Check Russia & the Phillipines, for example. Mark ------------------Occam's razor is not for shaving with.
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gene90 Member (Idle past 3851 days) Posts: 1610 Joined: |
quote: No, they were in cold storage below decks.
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gene90 Member (Idle past 3851 days) Posts: 1610 Joined: |
quote: Morris was a geologist, Gish was a biochemist (and an Ivy League grad if I remember correctly) and Gentry is a physicist.
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wj Inactive Member |
Mark, I suppose it's not surprising that there seems to be a negative correlation between bible (The Bible is the actual word of God and it is to be taken literally, word for word) and evolution (Human beings developed from earlier species of animals). The former view is most characteristic of yecs who are the most dramatically opposed to evolution. The figures for belief in god, afterlife etc. would likely include a significant number of theists who would not necessarily reject evolution.
Isn't it interesting that Americans aren't as god-fearing or bible-loving as Filipinos but are stronger in their rejection of evolution.
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Quetzal Member (Idle past 5900 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
Don't forget Jonathan Wells - PhD's in Biology and Theology, both from very good schools. I'm also pretty sure Michael Denton had a biology or biology-related degree (of course, that's why he's completely recanted "Theory in Crisis").
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3945 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 10.0 |
From "Old Earth Creationism"
http://EvC Forum: Old Earth Creationism -->EvC Forum: Old Earth Creationism : quote: Kurt Wise, PhD, Paleontology, Harvard. Studied under Stephan Jay Gould. Apparently a creationist, and a scientist, but not a "creation scientist". Hope I got that right. Moose
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Mammuthus Member (Idle past 6503 days) Posts: 3085 From: Munich, Germany Joined: |
Hi Percy,
That about sums up my point. It is also similar to the data in the link schrafinator posted. Moose, Quetzal, and wj posted 3 examples of creationist scientists but again, from the statistics, the 3 are a minority. I still think it is expected that those accepting evolution in general are better educated in or at least more active in learning about science and that it is not an artifact of forums like EvC. cheers,M
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Tranquility Base Inactive Member |
Percy
One thing that that hasn't been taken into account is asking people who are about to get a science degree. Could it be that people doing that already think naturalistically more then the average? Of course. I still admitt that more education tends to increase eovluitonary thinking but but not to the extent that you think (due to my first sentence) and not for the reason you suspect. It is becasue most universities teach evoluttion only and ridicule creation of course!
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Mammuthus Member (Idle past 6503 days) Posts: 3085 From: Munich, Germany Joined: |
quote: ***************+ Hi TB,I have never taken or heard of a university course on evolution that ridicules creation...creationism is not discussed since it is not science. How often do you hear discussions on evolutionary biology in church? Note: I have not been to church in a really really long time so maybe things have changed cheersM
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Tranquility Base Inactive Member |
Direct ridiculing is pretty rare in universities I agree but I've seen it and definitely in research seminars.
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