EvC Forum: Why was a flood needed?

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Topic: Why was a flood needed?

Asgara

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From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 55 of 90 (45676)
07-10-2003 2:37 PM

Reply to: Message 51 by mike the wiz
07-10-2003 2:14 PM

Hi Mike,

When you discuss Darwin's problem with the fossil record, are you referring to this quote, commonly found on creation websites?

"Why then is not every geological formation and every stratum full of such intermediate links? Geology assuredly does not reveal any such finely-graduated organic chain; and this, perhaps, is the most obvious and serious objection which can be urged against the theory."
The Origin of Species (1859) in Chapter 10, On the imperfection of the geologic record.

Does your sourse also supply the next part of that quote?

The explanation lies, as I believe, in the extreme imperfection of the geological record.
In the first place, it should always be borne in mind what sort of intermediate forms must, on the theory, have formerly existed

Darwin wrote his tome 150 years ago and made many predictions concerning fossils that would need to be found to validate his theory.

Predicted that in pre-Silurian rocks one should find precursors to trilobites they were found
suggested that the (at that time) lack of precambrian fossils would be a valid arguement to his theory and predicted that these fossils would be found. they were discovered starting almost 100 years after Darwin wrote on this
I won't go on in this list as it is very nicely set out here

You stated on post 47 of this thread:

as God told me 'do not be dismayed or they will confound you'.

this is the only thing I seem to agree with you on....you DO seem confounded.

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 51 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 2:14 PM		mike the wiz has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 58 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 3:51 PM		Asgara has replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 57 of 90 (45678)
07-10-2003 3:00 PM

Reply to: Message 56 by Percy
07-10-2003 2:42 PM

Well put Percy!

There is an interesting and (I think) humorous story on the web that very succinctly shows the type of circular reasoning, and reliance on man's word as the word of God, that is employed by biblical literalists.

I won't post the story or link here, as I'm sure some will find it offensive, but it can be found easily by those who wish. Google for "kissing hank's a*s".

Those who are offended by the implications of the title in regards to a literal reading of man's fallible word in the Bible need not search for the story, as I assure you, if the title offends you the story will also.

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 56 by Percy, posted 07-10-2003 2:42 PM		Percy has not replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 63 of 90 (45685)
07-10-2003 4:15 PM

Reply to: Message 58 by mike the wiz
07-10-2003 3:51 PM

Hi Mike,

You state:

no, i am referring to the total lack of evidence that suggests proof of evolution.and guess what you can bring a whole team of scientists down here if you want i am NOT phased.

But you DID bring up your view that Darwin had a problem with the fossil record:

but even Darwin thought the fossils were a problem before his evo theory which is FALSE

So you yourself are bringing in a scientist and misrepresenting his views, yet you suggest that evolutionists cannot phase(sic) you with scientific views. If you want to state that the views of mainstream science have no effect on you, why do YOU then bring them into the discussion? Please tell me it wasn't to deliberately misrepresent them to help you prove your point.

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 58 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 3:51 PM		mike the wiz has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 65 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 4:22 PM		Asgara has replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 70 of 90 (45692)
07-10-2003 4:37 PM

Reply to: Message 65 by mike the wiz
07-10-2003 4:22 PM

Hi Mike,

Thanks for responding again.

well just look at the chances i have give them to rid the flood,boy this stuff is weak , if anything its strengthened my view!

All I have seen you do, in trying to refute what has been told to you, is to state that it is a matter of interpretation of the evidence. You imply that to call your interpretation wrong is hypocritical.

Some interpretations CAN be definately wrong; wrong, illogical, and unreasoned. I state here that all grass is red...any statement that says that grass is generally green is simply a wrong interpretation, caused by faulty eyesight.

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 65 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 4:22 PM		mike the wiz has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 71 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 4:48 PM		Asgara has replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 73 of 90 (45695)
07-10-2003 5:30 PM

Reply to: Message 71 by mike the wiz
07-10-2003 4:48 PM

Hi Mike,

Please, then, give me YOUR explanation for the geologic column and the various strata found, for the question of where all the water for this flood came from and where it went, for the consistency in the various radiometric dating methods, for the sorting of the fossil sequence. Why are the gymnosperms found before the angiosperms? The invertabrates before the vertabrates, reptiles before mammals?

And many, many fossils have been "eaten away", leaving us with impressions in rock, not the actual artifacts, leaving us with petrified remains (organic material replaced over time with minerals), and also leaving us with disarticulated and obviously gnawed on skeletons.

I am not a scientist nor even a particularly scholarly person, so please forgive any unclear wordings. I am sure that the more knowledgable members of this board will correct any gross errors I have made.

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 71 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 4:48 PM		mike the wiz has not replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 78 of 90 (45707)
07-10-2003 8:42 PM

Reply to: Message 76 by mike the wiz
07-10-2003 8:04 PM

Mike,

I would appreciate a response to this post, #63, before you quit.

no, i am referring to the total lack of evidence that suggests proof of evolution.and guess what you can bring a whole team of scientists down here if you want i am NOT phased.

But you DID bring up your view that Darwin had a problem with the fossil record:

but even Darwin thought the fossils were a problem before his evo theory which is FALSE

In reply to your last post:

well this amazes me,people dont have a problem with water on mars but they fail to see where the water comes from on Earth, listen there is a hell of a lot of water on earth 'and the water of the deep was broken up' this is roughly what the scripture says, personally i think fountains of water burst from way below,as 'broken up' would indicate, i dont think this would have been a major problem for the Creator.

This topic has absolutely nothing to do with water on Mars. It has to do with the amount of water on Earth. I have no problem understanding the water table, what I fail to understand is how this is suppose to rise up and cover the mountaintops and level off to cover the entire earth. Or are you one of the proponents of "the mountains were not as we have them now but were created by the flood and/or after it"? If so, please cite your reasoning.

I am glad to see that you do not list the "canopy" argument, as this would create even more problems for you to address.

Thank you

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 76 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 8:04 PM		mike the wiz has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 79 by mike the wiz, posted 07-10-2003 8:48 PM		Asgara has not replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

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Message 87 of 90 (45717)
07-10-2003 10:02 PM

Reply to: Message 86 by Brian
07-10-2003 9:42 PM

Re: Just as I prophecised

Oh Great Brian,

I bow down in humble suplication and ask..."Can you predict if I will win the lottery this week?"

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 86 by Brian, posted 07-10-2003 9:42 PM		Brian has replied

Replies to this message:
	Message 88 by Brian, posted 07-10-2003 10:25 PM		Asgara has replied

Asgara

Member (Idle past 2333 days)

Posts: 1783

From: Wisconsin, USA

Joined: 05-10-2003

Normal Thread Display

Message 89 of 90 (45719)
07-10-2003 10:39 PM

Reply to: Message 88 by Brian
07-10-2003 10:25 PM

Re: Just as I prophecised

Oh Great Brian,

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Asgara

"An unexamined life is not worth living" Socrates via Plato

This message is a reply to:
	Message 88 by Brian, posted 07-10-2003 10:25 PM		Brian has not replied

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