Does the bible condemn homosexuality?

AIDS spead in the gay community in north america at first. That is not where it started. To focus on that is to miss something important.There is no hint that it "started" in any connection to sex actually. No one hints that any one had sex with monkeys. It is the eating of bush meat that probably helped it jump the species barrier.We are talking about the spread of it. I don't have any idea how the spread occured orginally in Africa but since it has been uncovered it has been an "equal opportunity disease" and cerainly a heterosexual one. So it is reasonable to suppose that it's initial spread was hetrosexually.The fact that it spread, in North America, first in the gay community is an indictment of careless, promiscuous sex not homosexuality per se. The focus on it as a gay disease is somesort of obession with fundamentalists.If it was god's punishment I would expect that straights would be somehow immune. That seems resonable to me. But i guess perhaps God intended that and messed up the details of the design. That's not surprising since s/he has seemed to be a "big picture" sort from way back.

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a "clan" (clan???)

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I just assumed he was referring to the notorious ninja homosexuals of feudal Japan

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"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

You are my hero.

Shall we create a Chicago chapter of the Rei appreciation society? Pulling that pic out as quickly as she did beats hands down anything I have ever seen on this forum.------------------
holmes[This message has been edited by holmes, 09-25-2003]

I'm there. Anyone who can find pictures of gay ninja is tops in my book.

hehe, I just whipped it together when Dan said that... it's his fault, he got the image stuck in my head. I'm a former photo-editing competitor from Worth1000.com ------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

Joralex writes:

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Anyone old enough to remember when AIDS first hit the scene knows that AIDS was directly associated with homosexual male-to-male practice.

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Only in the West.There's a much bigger world out there beyond Europe and the US.Question: How many cases of HIV infection exist, worldwide?Question: How many cases of HIV infection exist in the US and Europe?Question: What is the percentage of HIV infection in the US and Europe compared to the world?Question: Where did HIV first appear in the world that we can tell?You will notice that this indicates that HIV is and always has been a disease primarily transmitted by heterosexual sex. It is only in the US and Europe that it managed to show up first in men who have sex with men. As time has passed, we find that it is becoming like the rest of the world: A disease primarily transmitted by heterosexual sex.

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You shouldn't try to alter/cover up history so as to justify what is unacceptable to God.

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I thought bearing false witness was one of the things that god commanded against. You would do well to take your own words to heart. You are altering and covering up history so as to justify what is unacceptable to god.Or is lying for Jesus not a sin?------------------
Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

holmes writes:

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And unfortunately patient 0 for America was a swinging (I think Canadian) airline steward who traveled all over, spreading the virus specifically to other swinging gays.

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Just to be picky:We have no idea who "Patient Zero" was for bringing HIV into the US. Yes, early in the investigation of AIDS in the US, a population study was conducted that resulted in Gaetan Dugas being the infection vector for that population study...the "patient zero." However, he was not the vector for the entire epidemic in the US. There were a few hundred cases that were known at the time and only 40 were traceable back to Dugas.And while I'm reluctant to even recognize Joralex's comments, I should point out that gay men have a lower incidence of molestation of children than heterosexuals.In fact, given the fact that most molestations of children occur at the hands of relatives and friends, your child is safer in a group of gay male strangers than with your brother-in-law.------------------
Rrhain
WWJD? JWRTFM!

Two points: That's only because people like you won't let them get married. So it isn't that God doesn't like it, it's that people like you don't like it. Given that animals regularly engage in homosexual behavior are you willing to revise your definition of what is natural and what is not? I mean, if it's done in nature, how can it be unnatural?

Oh yeah, thanks for mentioning that, Crash. Bedbugs can even reproduce indirectly through homosexual sex. Whiptail lizards can *only* reproduce through homosexual sex. Bonobos do same sex activity all of the time. As do numerous other primates, dolphins, and many other animals.But Joralex, don't take answering this question as being an excuse for getting out of the other issues that I've raised. ------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."

Although I am with you on this question (of homosexuality being natural), since joralex bases his definition on what the Bible says is God's definition, he can say this.Now perhaps this is a good question for the inerrancy of the Bible. Why does God say males having sex with males is an unnatural use of sex when it is so prevalent in nature? I suppose the answer will come down to the idea that humans get a separate set of rules.And how can we argue against such things? I think this is simply a good reason not to believe in something as silly as the Bible. But if someone does believe, then all sorts of ludicrous beliefs can be held quite consistently.------------------
holmes

If humans get a separate set of rules than nature, wouldn't that make every single thing we do unnatural, by definition?Not that I'm arguing with you, specifically. Just with this train of thought.

Unfortunately this does not follow.What it would mean is that there are natural rules for humans, and natural rules for everything else. But it would all be natural.I guess the equivalent would be the rule that things are either particles or waves, but light acts as both... so light plays by separate rules, even if those rules are natural.Then again I have had some sexual encounters my partners said bordered on the supernatural so I guess there is a third component. Natural sex, unnatural sex, and supernatural sex.------------------
holmes

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Natural sex, unnatural sex, and supernatural sex.

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Where can I get a copy of this "Natural Rules for Humans" book? Because I seem to have misplaced mine, and the bible... well, we've already discussed that. ------------------
"Illuminant light,
illuminate me."