Herbal supplements in US commonly have traces of contaminants

Herbal Supplements Often Have Contaminants, Study Finds - The New York TimesLong ago, Buzsaw and I had grappled frequently over the issue of herbal supplements in the US. I was for treating them as drugs wrt regulations. He was for pretty much no regulation at all, as far as I could tell.I frequently warned that in the current regulatory climate, a time would soon come when we would learn of the danger of these products through just such a problem.As soon as I heard of this, in fact, I immediately thought of Buzsaw, and wondered how he and others like him would be taking the news.Prediction; a No True Scottsman Fallacy in 5...4...3...2...Edited by returninator, : No reason given.Edited by returninator, : No reason given.

Currently, herbal supplements are not regulated even as well as food is. Actually, the FDA has been wanting to regulate herbal supplements for years and years, and it is the conservatives in congress who have consistently and repeatedly weakened most regulatory bodies like the FDA, the EPA, etc. I don't blame Big Business; they are doing what they are supposed to be doing. I blame our elected officials for gutting funding and power to the regulatory agencies.

Buzsaw, did you read the OP at all??I linked to an article about herbs for sale in US being commonly contaminated with pesticides and heavy metals.We're hearing about contaminated herbs, Buz.

Er, what do any of those have to do with herbal supplements?

So, can you point to a time in history in the US when we had the correct level of regulation, in your opinion?Or, can you point to a nation that currently seems to, in your estimation, have a good situation going on that we should try to emulate? You mean like China?...which is where these contaminated herbs are grown.

Yes, this is exactly my position as well.

Define "fully regulated" wrt tobacco. Used moderately, alcohol is healthy. Prescription drugs and aspirin also help a lot of people every year.Nobody is saying that prescription drugs or aspirin are 100% safe. Indeed, all drugs that have effects also have side effects, and this includes herbal drugs.If an herbal drug is powerful enough to have a theraputic effect, it is also powerful enough to be a poison/have side effects. All I am suggesting is that we treat herbal drugs the same way we treat any other drug; their safety and efficacy should be demonstrated in studies paid for by any company that wishes to make health claims and make a profit selling them to the public.If someone wants to grow herbs themselves and ingest them, that's fine, but selling them for profit is quite another thing.As it stands right now, companies that sell herbal drugs do not have to have consistent doses, don't have to test their products for safety or efficacy before putting them on the market. "Nutritional supplements" don't have to be tested even as much as my Listerine mouthwash does.Edited by returninator, : to remove fragment

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'Explanations like "God won't be tested by scientific studies" but local yokels can figure it out just by staying aware of what's going on have no rational basis whatsoever.' -Percy"What we need is not the will to believe but the will to find out." - Bertrand Russell"Man's greatest asset is the unsettled mind." - Isaac Asimov"We not only believe what we see, to some extent we see what we believe
...The implications of our beliefs are frightening." - Richard Gregory

And I could point to millions of people's who's lives are saved, or were/are being significantly prolonged, and the quality of their lives being immeasurably improved by phameceuticals.I'm not saying that there are no problems with the FDA. There are, and they need to be addressed and fixed.My point is that however flawed the FDA's drug testing system is, it is far, far better than no testing at all, which is the current situation with herbal drugs on the market. Edited by returninator, : No reason given.Edited by returninator, : to clarify

Clearly, you can, as the tobacco industry illustrates very well. The trick is to hook them young and then to not kill many of your customers quickly.Anyway...Can you point to a time in history, or a current nation, where this free market situation has worked, or is working, well?Edited by nator, : fixed italics

How does that compare to the number of people who's lives are saved, significantly improved and prolonged by medical practice and prescribed drugs?There are many millions of people all over the world who take prescription drugs and who undergo medical treatements every year, buz.The meaningful number is not any of the ones you listed, but the ratio or percentage comparing the good outcomes with the bad ones.

Why not, when they are used as medicine?They certainly aren't used because they are delicious additions to your favorite recipe.They aren't marketed as food products. The language on the packages talk about things like reproductive organs, bladders, hearts, and digestive systems, and what effects the contents of the box has on the body. Oh, so there is data available on adverse reactions experienced by people taking herbal drugs? Tell me, in which states are Naturopaths, herbalists, health food store clerks, and other people who prescribe herbal drugs to their patients required by the government to report adverse reactions?MDs and hospitals are required, by law, to report these incidents, which is why we have such a lot of information about adverse drug reactions.I wasn't aware that we had the same sort of data for herbal drugs. Where can I find it?Edited by nator, : fixed quote boxEdited by nator, : No reason given.Edited by nator, : No reason given.

If you agree that all drugs and treatments, including herbal drugs, need to be double blind tested, then you agree that they need to be regulated.

How do you know they are telling the truth, just because it says so on the label? How do you figure, when synthetic molecules are, you know, synthesized, i.e. every aspect of their manufacture is supervised and controlled in a lab situation, plus they go through legally-required and quite strict quality control for dosage and impurities?Did you read the article I linked to? When the FDA tested many different supplements, they found that:"some athletes have been rendered ineligible for international competitions because they took supplements that contained steroids not listed on the products' labels. There are thousands of supplements available for sale that contain steroids or other harmful ingredients"and"... one in four have quality problems. According to Dr. Cooperman's written testimony, the most common problems are supplements that lack adequate quantities of the indicated ingredients and those contaminated with heavy metals." What unregulated foods? All foods in the US are regulated, buz.

Regulations require the tests. Regulations should also require the companies wishing to profit from the sale of these items to demonstrate that these products are safe and effective for whatever the company is claiming on the label before they are allowed on the market.Are you suggesting that we go back to snake-oil days, when any shyster with a lot of enthusiastic selling techniques can put whatever they want in a bottle and sell it?

Well no, that's not true in my experience. I worked in a large co-op grocery store that sold tons and tons of herbal tea that was not advertized as food, but as medicine. One brand is even called "Traditional Medicinals". People came in all the time with specific ailments they were hoping to help with these teas, which they didn't drink at other times. No buz, those aren't actually supplements. Those are just regular foods, because they have nutritive value.What the FDA defines as "nutritional supplements" are things like St. John's Wort, echinacia, ginko-biloba, ginseng, kava, etc. Things that have no nutritive value.St. John's Wort is something that people take for depression. They take it as an antidepressant. In other words, they use it as a medication to treat their depression. Right? It is relevant if you are claiming that these things are food, though. They aren't culinary herbs, buz. They have no nutritional value. They are thought to have medicinal effects only. Yes, but their effectiveness is also relevant to the topic, as well. Should a company be able to sell an herb as something that has a beneficial effect on high blood pressure if that company cannot demonstrate that the product actually does have the effect they are claiming? How is this known? Indeed, buz, follow the money. The herbal supplement industry is a multi-billion dollar a year big, big business that is mostly owned by Big Pharma! Most of the supplements for sale in the US are grown and manufactured in China, because its cheaper and the regulators for organics and whatnot are less bothersome.