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Author | Topic: Supreme Court upholds Obamacare | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Why then, so many coming across the border for health care, due to the wait in Canada for treatment?
But of course you have no evidence of this.But I have evidence to refute this. Link Link Your links use data from the 1990's. Here is a report that was just released that uses data from 2011, and they conclude:
quote:
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
What does it mean when the doctors are against it?
Almost 90% of them think medicine is on the wrong track.Over 80% are thinking about quitting. Over 60% say its getting harder to adhere to the Hippocratic oath. From a recent survey of doctors Looks bad to me. Here's the general concludions and key findings from an article about the survey:
quote: Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
When I look at doctors as a group I don't see them working on a solution for affordable health care for all americans. They whinge, but refuse to engage. So? Does that make their complaints unfounded?
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
At least you could have used a non-partisan groups study that wasn't using questionable methodology.
Fraser Institute quote: Really? You berate Buz for not having a source and when a source is provided you Poison the Well. tsk tsk
Their methodology is no different than creationism. They are looking for evidence to back up their goals. They are not following evidence to a conclusion. They have their conclusion and are looking for anything, even playing with statistics, to "prove" their stance. Which was your methodology as well. Buz made a claim that you wanted to prove wrong so you claim you refuted it by Googling up some data from ~15 years ago
Their 'evidence" is a "waiting list survey" that they send to physicians. There is no independent verification of this data. Is it not possible that only like minded physicians participate? I know if my wife received a survey from the Heritage Institute she would throw it away. Without a a more comprehensive review of the methodology their numbers mean nothing. But there are huge other factors too. Look at their references. Not a single one is an independent reference. The author uses himself as a reference. Everyone of them refers to a Fraser Institute document. You forgot the biggest factor: their results don't agree with your preconceived notion. Better attack the source!
Now lets look at the figures. 43,000 Canadians sought care outside of Canada. Canada has a population of about 33 million. I will let you figure the percentage. So if the Fraser institutes #'s a correct then miniscule # of Canadians are seeking healthcare out of Canada. Which is in direct support of my arguments and the links I provided. Thank you. Actually, a better percentage would be that of those seeking medical attention rather than that of the entire population.
Now lets look at another point of this "study". You are using it to support the notion that Canadians are fleeing to the US for healthcare. I do not see anything about the US in your link. So this is of absolutely no support of your argument. Of the times that people went to other countries, what percentage do you think were to the US? More than 90%?
A little aside.
Meh. Apples and Oranges. Those countries have a fraction of the population that we do.
So any evidence at all that Canadians are coming over to the US in droves for healthcare? Any evidence at all that a significant percentage of Canadians prefer the US system as opposed to theirs? Why? You want to poison some more wells?
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
I gather from the article that this was a blast fax w/ a 4% response rate. How accurate can those numbers really be? Color me skeptical. You gotta be careful with any survey. For all we know, only the docs who were already pissed off were the ones who took the survey. I don't know if 4% is a good return or not. I'm not asking you to drop any skepticism.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Meh. Apples and Oranges. Those countries have a fraction of the population that we do. First, that not true. Germanys 80 million+ citizens is hardly a fraction. Neither is britains 60 mil+. Well, those fractions would be about 1/4 and 1/5, respectively.
Second, why do you think that population size matter? Really, tell me. It seems straight forward to me that the more people you've got to take care of, the harder its going to be. Should I think otherwise? Only two countries have more people than the US; China and India (which have about 5x and 4x the population of the US, respectively) How's their healthcare rank? According to the WHO ranking, China is 144th and India 112th.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
China has a per capita GDP of $5,413, India's $3,693 and the US? $48,386. See, thats why. Germany has a rather more comparable GDP per capita at $43,741. Does Germany have the same "1%" problem that the US has? What's the numbers for the people in the bottom 5% or so look like? How many poor, uneducated, and/or overweight people does Germany have? How's the environment compare? Geographical distribution? Population density? There's a shit-pile of variables...
Comparing US healthcare to China or Indias, is comparing apple and oranges.. Comparing US healthcare with western europe healthcare makes sense. Well I disagree and I'm not just going to take your word for it. ABE Clarification: I don't mean that I disagree that comparing to China or India is apples to oranges. I disagree with the second sentence. Edited by Catholic Scientist, : see ABE
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
So? Does that make their complaints unfounded?
It makes their complaints irrelevant. I think they're still interesting. We kinda need the doctors in order to have healthcare...
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
We kinda need the doctors in order to have healthcare...
We don't need those doctors, though. How do you know?
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Because political views have nothing to do with a person's medical abilities. Wait... then how would these doctors' political views mean that we don't need them?
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
I think your preconceived beliefs have overtaken your ability to examine data critically. Why?
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