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Author Topic:   Why is evolution so controversial?
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 695 of 969 (739738)
10-27-2014 1:17 PM
Reply to: Message 689 by RAZD
10-26-2014 6:44 PM


Recent origins
quote:
There are plenty of critics within the field -- where do you think the "explosion of new supposed of hominids" comes from? Dogmatic pontificators?
The evidence of a very recent ancestor is closer than ever. The linkage disequilibrium is moving too fast according to new findings. The suggestion is that evolution is moving 100 times faster than thought. If a individual was determined to be an ancestor of 500,000 tears ago they might only be as recent as 5,000 years.
We are more different genetically from people living 5,000 years ago than they were different from Neanderthals. Genome study places modern humans in the evolutionary fast lane
Now there is a coalescence of sorts in these findings. The finding that point mutations are happening at a slower rate than once predicted (~ 1.1 x10^-8 as opposed to 2.58 x 10^-8... about half) and that linkage disequilibrium is occurring 100 times faster than predicted. A recent origin is the best explanation. The mutation rate in humans can not support a 5.6 million year divergence from chimps and measured linkage disequilibrium dictates a young origin of humans.
"UW-Madison anthropologist John Hawks estimates that positive selection just in the past 5,000 years alone around the period of the Stone Age has occurred at a rate roughly 100 times higher than any other period of human evolution." Genome study places modern humans in the evolutionary fast lane

This message is a reply to:
 Message 689 by RAZD, posted 10-26-2014 6:44 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 698 by NoNukes, posted 10-27-2014 1:37 PM zaius137 has replied
 Message 707 by Coyote, posted 10-27-2014 3:10 PM zaius137 has not replied
 Message 723 by RAZD, posted 10-27-2014 8:22 PM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 696 of 969 (739740)
10-27-2014 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 694 by Dr Adequate
10-27-2014 12:24 PM


quote:
Here is Velhurst's original paper on the subject, published in 1844. If you think it has been superseded, let us know where.
Very funny how about english. I am one of those assimilated americans, you know the culturally challenged group.
Edited by zaius137, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 694 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-27-2014 12:24 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 716 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-27-2014 5:57 PM zaius137 has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 699 of 969 (739743)
10-27-2014 1:49 PM
Reply to: Message 698 by NoNukes
10-27-2014 1:37 PM


Re: Recent origins
To NoNukes I can get better responses when talking to drunk.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 698 by NoNukes, posted 10-27-2014 1:37 PM NoNukes has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 700 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 1:59 PM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 701 of 969 (739747)
10-27-2014 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 700 by New Cat's Eye
10-27-2014 1:59 PM


Re: Recent origins
Excellent post. Cheers!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 700 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 1:59 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 703 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 2:39 PM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 702 of 969 (739748)
10-27-2014 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 697 by NoNukes
10-27-2014 1:28 PM


You too my friend... Excellent post. Cheers!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 697 by NoNukes, posted 10-27-2014 1:28 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 704 of 969 (739750)
10-27-2014 2:44 PM


Any real comment?
We are more different genetically from people living 5,000 years ago than they were different from Neanderthals." Genome study places modern humans in the evolutionary fast lane
Any real comments?
Edited by zaius137, : No reason given.

Replies to this message:
 Message 708 by sfs, posted 10-27-2014 3:49 PM zaius137 has replied
 Message 709 by NoNukes, posted 10-27-2014 4:03 PM zaius137 has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 705 of 969 (739751)
10-27-2014 2:53 PM
Reply to: Message 703 by New Cat's Eye
10-27-2014 2:39 PM


quote:
What's it like to be such a moron?
First question I ask myself when going to bed at night At least for now my question excludes idiot. In case that question ever pops up at night, How do you answer?
An idiot, dolt, or dullard is an intellectually disabled person, or someone who acts in a self-defeating or significantly counterproductive way. Idiot - Wikipedia

This message is a reply to:
 Message 703 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 2:39 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 706 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 3:05 PM zaius137 has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 713 of 969 (739763)
10-27-2014 5:28 PM
Reply to: Message 708 by sfs
10-27-2014 3:49 PM


Re: Any real comment?
quote:
Yeah -- it was a really bad study. It misrepresented the findings of the Voight et al. study and it didn't take into account how much easier it is to detect recent selection than older selection. The paper should be dropped into the ocean and forgotten.
sfs unbelievable. Why are you even talking to me? I thought you had enough our last go-around. Well as for my part I really like talking to you. So let’s see if I can turn you into a creationist (obviously I failed last time).
I will first ask you your opinion on why how much easier it is to detect recent selection than older selection.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 708 by sfs, posted 10-27-2014 3:49 PM sfs has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 720 by sfs, posted 10-27-2014 7:00 PM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 714 of 969 (739764)
10-27-2014 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 712 by New Cat's Eye
10-27-2014 4:26 PM


Re: Recent origins
Great post... Cheers!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 712 by New Cat's Eye, posted 10-27-2014 4:26 PM New Cat's Eye has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 715 of 969 (739765)
10-27-2014 5:31 PM
Reply to: Message 710 by NoNukes
10-27-2014 4:10 PM


Re: Recent origins
Great post... Cheers!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 710 by NoNukes, posted 10-27-2014 4:10 PM NoNukes has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 725 of 969 (739796)
10-28-2014 12:00 AM
Reply to: Message 718 by Genomicus
10-27-2014 6:02 PM


Re: What if God used evolution to create man?
quote:
So will you concede that your initial argument for a recent human origin falls short? Otherwise, I'll be expecting a biologically sound response to my points above.
I have some more information that might help this discussion to continue, all good things come to those who cook... I mean wait.
Right now let us talk with sfs.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 718 by Genomicus, posted 10-27-2014 6:02 PM Genomicus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 733 by Genomicus, posted 10-28-2014 5:34 AM zaius137 has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 726 of 969 (739797)
10-28-2014 12:05 AM
Reply to: Message 723 by RAZD
10-27-2014 8:22 PM


Re: Recent origins or more recent misreading ...
Razd my friend this conversation is a topic in itself But my plan is to lead into it slowly I think that slowing down to address other details at the moment might help. We will tie all this in my friend. Thanks for getting back to the conversation, i thought you dropped out from boredom.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 723 by RAZD, posted 10-27-2014 8:22 PM RAZD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 728 by Coyote, posted 10-28-2014 12:22 AM zaius137 has replied
 Message 744 by RAZD, posted 10-28-2014 5:09 PM zaius137 has not replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 727 of 969 (739798)
10-28-2014 12:15 AM
Reply to: Message 720 by sfs
10-27-2014 7:00 PM


Re: Any real comment?
quote:
Much easier. The long-haplotype tests that the Hawks paper referenced lose all power after about 20,000 years or so.
Is this the gist of your opinion?
quote:
These results are intriguing (and controversial they've already generated much discussion within the scientific community), but they do have limitations. The technique that the researchers used (looking for genomic evidence of past hitchhiking events) is reliable, but it is not particularly good at detecting very old or very recent episodes of selection. That's because old advantageous mutants have been around for so long that recombination and mutation may have already wiped out the evidence of their selective sweep. Evolution in the fast lane? - Understanding Evolution
I have read some information concerning the topic of classic selective sweeps in humans. The claim is that there might be zero evidence that they happened in recent evolution. I think that would be about 250,000 years in evolution perspective.
A young genome of say 6000 years might just work out fine. Please speculate.
Edited by zaius137, : corrected from the paper

This message is a reply to:
 Message 720 by sfs, posted 10-27-2014 7:00 PM sfs has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 729 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-28-2014 12:28 AM zaius137 has replied
 Message 735 by sfs, posted 10-28-2014 8:04 AM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 730 of 969 (739802)
10-28-2014 12:50 AM
Reply to: Message 728 by Coyote
10-28-2014 12:22 AM


Re: Recent origins or ignoring evidence ...
Sorry Coyote We need to talk about your points, but since I am the Creationist here (population 1). Can we stay on the immediate topic. I think that time will bring us back to your points.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 728 by Coyote, posted 10-28-2014 12:22 AM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 752 by Coyote, posted 10-29-2014 1:16 AM zaius137 has replied

  
zaius137
Member (Idle past 3439 days)
Posts: 407
Joined: 05-08-2012


Message 731 of 969 (739803)
10-28-2014 12:52 AM
Reply to: Message 729 by Dr Adequate
10-28-2014 12:28 AM


Re: Any real comment?
Great post Cheers! As we belly up to the bar once more.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 729 by Dr Adequate, posted 10-28-2014 12:28 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
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