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Author Topic:   Questions for theo-evolutionists and evos
Abshalom
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 17 (74420)
12-20-2003 10:45 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by TheVanisher
12-20-2003 1:25 AM


Explain Prophesy
How does one explain all the New Testament prophesies that have not come to pass?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by TheVanisher, posted 12-20-2003 1:25 AM TheVanisher has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by sidelined, posted 12-21-2003 11:22 AM Abshalom has replied

Abshalom
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 17 (74697)
12-22-2003 5:01 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by sidelined
12-21-2003 11:22 AM


Re: Explain Prophesy
Sidelined:
How about you pick out a few that are written between Rev. 1:1 wherein the prophesies were said to be given "to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass..." (reinforced by Rev. 1:3, "... that they hear the words of this prophesy and keep those things wich are written therein, for the time is at hand."), and Rev. 22:10, "And he saith unto me: Seal not the sayings of the prophesy of this book, for the time is at hand."
Anything unfullfilled from 1:3 through 22:10 will do for an example.
[This message has been edited by Abshalom, 12-22-2003]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by sidelined, posted 12-21-2003 11:22 AM sidelined has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by sidelined, posted 12-22-2003 8:29 PM Abshalom has replied

Abshalom
Inactive Member


Message 17 of 17 (74867)
12-23-2003 12:39 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by sidelined
12-22-2003 8:29 PM


Re: Explain Prophesy
Sidelined: Regarding your three questions in Post #13:
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Re: "And I will give [power] unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days, clothed in sackcloth."
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Q. #1: Who are the two witnesses?
A.: As this so-called "Book of Revelation" was first written sometime circa 70 CE by an apparent Jewish Essene or some sort of Jewish mystic scribe, I will assume the writer's throroughly Jewish theological outlook. (I'm aware that a later translation with certain more "Christian" symbolism and embellishments has come down to Christian theologians as the KJV version of "Revelation.") However, I am assuming this is YHVH, the god of the Israelites, conveying power to his two greatest prophets, Moses and Elijah.
As to the 2060 days, this appears to equal 70 Jewish lunar months, and is similar to Daniel's "Seventy Sevens" or 70 weeks of 7 days each, or in other words, emphasis by use of the number 7 as associated with YHVH.
Sack cloth is sack cloth, sometimes it is woven from hair and thus is dark brown or black, and in any case symbolizes redemption, is customarily worn by prophets, etc.
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Re: "And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail."
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Q. #2: What do you say this is about?
A.: Again, I have to assume the Jewish Messianic viewpoint considering the most likely authorship of this excerpt as well, and answer that subsequent to the destruction of the Temple in 70 CE, the unexplained disappearance of the Ark of the Covenant, and the fact that the Ark was never seen again on earth, the Jewish mystic who wrote this account apparently envisioned the Ark having ascended under its own power, been lifted by the angels, or simply beamed directly up into Zion to repose in the kindom of heaven.
As we all know, lightening, voices, thundering, earthquakes, and other wonderous natural phenomena like the parting of rivers and seas are frequently associated with the Ark throughout the Tanakh.
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Re: "[A]nd there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads."
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Q. #3: Again,the explanation for this?
A.: I find it curious that "dragons" are not mentioned, to my knowledge, anywhere in the Tanakh, but are frequently mentioned in the so-called "Book of Revelation." Like maybe 12 or 15 times. Was this book originally written or later transcribed by a person or persons living somewhere Northeast of Jerusalem and in closer proximity to cultures whose mythology was more infused with "dragons?" Maybe somewhere like Antioch which was at or near the Western terminus of the Silk Road?
The "Red Dragon" appears to be the origin of the Christian concept of Satan, the arch angel who after initiating a rebelion in heaven, is cast down to earth with his minions, all as described in this chapter of "Revelation."
Isn't it curious though, the similarities between this particular account wherein just before the appearance of the Red Dragon, "a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars (the zodiac)." This woman sure sounds a lot like Isis.
Reading further, "Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth." Give birth to whom, to Horus?
"And the Red Dragon (Set) stood before the woman (Isis) who was ready to give birth, to devour her child (Horus)."
So, Sidelined, my answer to your third question is basically this Red Dragon/Heavenly Madonna story appears to be the age-old myth originating in Egypt and translated and embellished all over the Mideast regarding the Madonna and Child (Isis and Horus) and the Evil One (Set, Shaiton, Satan, whoever), and I could hardly care less if the multiple heads of the dragon are the Hills of Rome, the non-Davidian Kings of Israel, the seven Roman emperors from Augustus to Vitellius, or subsequent Inquisitors, Illuminati, Nazis, Tzarist troglodites, Trilateral Commissioners, Soviet or post-Soviet commissars, or Skull and Bones co-conspirators
[This message has been edited by Abshalom, 12-23-2003]
[This message has been edited by Abshalom, 12-23-2003]

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