prayer/miracle cure

If being completely cured of a previously incurable illness resulted suddenly and unexpectedly from a prayer to God the previous night,can this be used as evidence of the existence of God? And what proof would be required other than the cure itself?
(video, witnesses...etc?)I was wondering what kind of proof/verification of god's existence would convince an agnostic, is all------------------

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Originally posted by graedek:
If being completely cured of a previously incurable illness resulted suddenly and unexpectedly from a prayer to God the previous night,can this be used as evidence of the existence of God? And what proof would be required other than the cure itself?
(video, witnesses...etc?)

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I was wondering what kind of proof/verification of god's existence would convince an agnostic, is all

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Start with confirming that the illness is cured and not just in some form of natural remission. Once you can show this we can then setup some additional experiments with various controls and checks (i.e. no praying, praying to different gods, praying to multiple gods, animal therapy, etc).After multiple such test you should have enough data that you can start analysing the data.Unfortunately for you, these sorts of tests have been done and the picture doesn't favour Christianity or any other religion.------------------
compmage

How many people do you think pray for their pain and suffering to be cured when dying from cancer? But how many of these millions survive (without modern medicine)?Then we get some anecdote about some bloke in some country who allegedly had hemorrhoids, prayed for a week, and is now running in marathons.Of course, if these people suffering from terminal illnesses do actually die, prayer or no prayer, it is said to be Gods plan. God can't lose can he?

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How many people do you think pray for their pain and suffering to be cured when dying from cancer?

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Now why do they feel compelled to pray? God loves a broken and contrite spirit.

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But how many of these millions survive (without modern medicine)?

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If he spares but one is that not evidence of his power. God created everything modern medicine can understand, even this is testimony to the power of the Almighty God.

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Then we get some anecdote about some bloke in some country who allegedly had hemorrhoids, prayed for a week, and is now running in marathons.

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I can give much better examples if you require them. This is a mockery, completely unbased. A very poor argument against the healing power of the Most High. Try and give some actual argument, not just a mere ignorant mockery. I'm sorry that's a strong sounding statement but that's all it sounded like to me.

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Of course, if these people suffering from terminal illnesses do actually die, prayer or no prayer, it is said to be Gods plan. God can't lose can he?

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No God can't lose. We can lose. We can lose out on eternity with our Creator. We can be subject to infinate despair. God is just, death has a purpose. I believe very stubornly that God Almighty is just.------------------
Saved by an incredible Grace.[This message has been edited by funkmasterfreaky, 12-16-2002]

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Originally posted by funkmasterfreaky:
Now why do they feel compelled to pray? God loves a broken and contrite spirit.

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So do predators and con artists....

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If he spares but one is that not evidence of his power.

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ummmm..... no. Unless you can prove that he did the sparing.

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God created everything modern medicine can understand, even this is testimony to the power of the Almighty God.

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Baseless assertion. You are advocating invisible Legos.

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I can give much better examples if you require them.

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Not if they are the ones you gave me in another post.

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This is a mockery, completely unbased. A very poor argument against the healing power of the Most High.

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Sorry, why? God doesn't heal hemoroids?

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No God can't lose.

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The argument was directed at the claims for God's healing activities. What you have done is assume that God exists and started to preach. You missed the point.------------------
No webpage found at provided URL: www.hells-handmaiden.com

LOL! Busted! I was pretty preachy there I am sorry I'll get down off my applebox again.

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Originally posted by funkmasterfreaky:
Now why do they feel compelled to pray? God loves a broken and contrite spirit.
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So do predators and con artists....

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Predators and con artist seek to exploit and victimize the broken and contrite spirit. God seeks to reconcile and heal these things. One seeks out of hate and greed. The other out of love and grace. This still doesn't answer the question of what compels people to pray when it's out of their own hands.

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This is a mockery, completely unbased. A very poor argument against the healing power of the Most High.
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Sorry, why? God doesn't heal hemoroids?

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God does heal, not always because most of the time he wants to use these experiences to some end. When he does heal I think it's often for the same reason. The thread in the tapestry does not see it's overall place in the beautiful product.Again I have only personal experience to back up God's healing power, and it would be second hand to you, so I guess I can't push this much further as you will not accept my evidence.Maybe God is trying to teach you something with hemoroids. Maybe he's trying to teach someone else something. Maybe you just spend too much time sitting on your ass and it's your own fault you have hemoroids. LOL. Sorry I'm just joking around, and the word ass is one of my favorites in the english language. ------------------
Saved by an incredible Grace.[This message has been edited by funkmasterfreaky, 12-17-2002]

I was mocking anecdotes Funky. And anecdotes are by no means evidence of anything.Anyway If anyone has proof of miracle cures, post them here.

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Originally posted by funkmasterfreaky:
Predators and con artist seek to exploit and victimize the broken and contrite spirit.

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This is precisely what the church does funk.

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God seeks to reconcile and heal these things.

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You say heal. I say feed 'em a lie. Its a Jedi mind trick. Convince somebody that something or somebody is going to help, and that person feels better. This doesn't mean that it is true.Think about the parallel.1) The church
2) Sad person == someone in need of comfort
3) church promises comfort in exchange for something the person has
4) person gives life to church
5) church prospers
6) rewards never materialize; or never demonstrably materialize.1) con artist
2) mark
3) Con artists promises some kind of reward in exchange for an investment of some kind
4) mark agrees
5) con artist prospers
6) rewards never materialize

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One seeks out of hate and greed. The other out of love and grace.

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You think this because you have bought into the con.

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This still doesn't answer the question of what compels people to pray when it's out of their own hands.

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ummmm....... what? They have been brainwashed to think that prayer helps.

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God does heal, not always because most of the time he wants to use these experiences to some end. When he does heal I think it's often for the same reason. The thread in the tapestry does not see it's overall place in the beautiful product.

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So you have a self-fulfilling prophecy. Whatever happens you can argue that it is God's will. I can argue that my will has the same effects and logically, and experimentally, have the same level of certainty. Why is it you can't see this?

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Again I have only personal experience to back up God's healing power, and it would be second hand to you, so I guess I can't push this much further as you will not accept my evidence.

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Why should I funk? I had a friend tell me about how a group of witches performed a spell and made the rain stop. Should I accept that? Or do you think maybe I should look for something more solid?------------------
No webpage found at provided URL: www.hells-handmaiden.com