Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9164 total)
3 online now:
Newest Member: ChatGPT
Post Volume: Total: 916,914 Year: 4,171/9,624 Month: 1,042/974 Week: 1/368 Day: 1/11 Hour: 1/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Non-scientific evidence
New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 53 of 98 (560159)
05-13-2010 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by Straggler
05-12-2010 2:57 PM


Re: Explanation and Prediction
All I have ever said to you (in how many threads now?) is that the rational conclusion is to consider the best evidenced explanation as the one most likely to be correct (i.e. to best reflect reality).
I don't understand how you can disagree with that yet you seem intent on doing so. Why?
To maintain rationality, it has to logically follow from the evidence.
A liklihood of correctness does not logically follow from science.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Straggler, posted 05-12-2010 2:57 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Dr Adequate, posted 05-13-2010 4:47 PM New Cat's Eye has seen this message but not replied
 Message 65 by Straggler, posted 05-14-2010 9:19 PM New Cat's Eye has replied

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 69 of 98 (560983)
05-18-2010 10:59 AM
Reply to: Message 65 by Straggler
05-14-2010 9:19 PM


Re: Explanation and Prediction
We both agree (along with pretty much everyone else) that the scientific conclusion is more likely to be correct than any of the the unevidenced possibilities.
Not really... not for any possibility. You'd have to have a specific explanation to be comparing to.
We all agree for example that the underlying cause of gravity is more likley to be space-time curvature than magical gravity gnomes.
Yeah, because the gnomes are ridiculous. For something non-ridiculous we probably wouldn't be so hasty. We should be comparing the actual evidence for both propositions before saying which on we think is more likely. For the gnomes we ain't got shit...
CS writes:
A liklihood of correctness does not logically follow from science.
So according to science all possible explanations are equally likley to be correct.
No. If we don't have the liklihoods of correctness then how can we say they're equal? Saying they're equal is saying we do have those liklihoods and I'm saying that we don't have them.
But the fact is that the subjective experiences and forms of non-scientific "evidence" in which you place so much faith are much much better explained by phenomenon that have nothing to do with the existence of the supernatural.
I'm not seeing it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 65 by Straggler, posted 05-14-2010 9:19 PM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Straggler, posted 05-18-2010 11:29 AM New Cat's Eye has replied

New Cat's Eye
Inactive Member


Message 71 of 98 (560997)
05-18-2010 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by Straggler
05-18-2010 11:29 AM


Re: Explanation and Prediction
You seem to be disputing that science tells us that some explanations are more likely to be correct than others. Is that your position?
That depends on what kind of probability you are talking about, inductive or physical? In Message 157, I linked to the paper: The Concept of Inductive Probability. For the things we're discussing, science can get us to inductive probability but not physical probability.
Getting this deep into inductive logic to the point of that philisophical discussion is not something that interests me.
No. If we rely on what is subjectively considered ridiculous we get nowhere. What if space-time curvature is subjectively deemed ridiculous by some? What if competing explanations are both deemed sensible (e.g. the Big Bang Vs the Steady State universe for example)? How do we decide which explanation is more likely to be correct and which is not? I'll tell you - We use the scientific method.
Which implies that the scientific method has lead you away from the gnomes, but they're unfalsifyable...
Using the inductive probability to claim a physical probability is illogical.
qs=CSA liklihood of correctness does not logically follow from science.
Straggler writes:
So according to science all possible explanations are equally likley to be correct.
CS writes:
No. If we don't have the liklihoods of correctness then how can we say they're equal?
What other option is there?
Not knowing the liklihoods.
We both agree that certainty is rationally unjustifiable. So if we also eliminate likelihood that means we can can never consider any one explanation as more correct than any other on the basis of scientific investigation. But the whole point of science is to weed out wrong explanations and promote explanations that can rationally be considered correct. No?
I don't think so. It doesn't matter if its actually correct or not, it matters if it works and is reliable. You're assuming that working reliably means that its correct but science doesn't say this about it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Straggler, posted 05-18-2010 11:29 AM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by Straggler, posted 05-18-2010 12:53 PM New Cat's Eye has not replied

Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024