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Author | Topic: The Atheist Experience | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No money, just a pat on the back. Find the test first.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9512 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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Faith writes: No money, just a pat on the back. Find the test first. You've already failed the test. It was how you deal with bias when considering evidence. Especially evidence that you have a personal stake in. Not only did you fail, you refused to learn about it and how to deal it. You haven't even read the research on what it is. You're avoiding learning how to think critically and rationally and you've demonstrated that you can't.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Find a test. I found a few that aren't very apropos but I'm continuing to look.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Look, I know that confirmation bias involves ignoring the information that DOESN'T fit the perceived pattern. The thing is the pattern isn't resting on an exclusive collection of information but a preponderance of incidents with the same theme that occurred exactly on that theme, exactly, precisely, not two sentences away. I was getting lots of those. The theme is NOT that common and I haven't had one occur since. Which of course in itself suggests the whole thing was an illusion, but it was quite a collection of related images, seeming beyond chance.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : j Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Faith writes: Why not take Bob Altemeyer's test?
Find a test. I found a few that aren't very apropos but I'm continuing to look.quote: Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Tangle, addressing Faith writes: You do have a point in regards to subjective evidenced beliefs and how we do have a personal stake in them. It may well be that no believer can totally throw it all away in order to think critically. I try, but I won't simply let go of my strongly held beliefs in order to arrive at some possible truth which I don't trust nor feel comfortable with. You've already failed the test. It was how you deal with bias when considering evidence. Especially evidence that you have a personal stake in. Not only did you fail, but you also refused to learn about it and how to deal with it. You haven't even read the research on what it is. You're avoiding learning how to think critically and rationally and you've demonstrated that you can't.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
You do have a point in regards to subjective evidenced beliefs and how we do have a personal stake in them. It may well be that no believer can totally throw it all away in order to think critically. I try, but I won't simply let go of my strongly held beliefs in order to arrive at some possible truth which I don't trust nor feel comfortable with. If you believe the Bible is God's inspired word to us, you don't treat it as man-made by subjecting it to the kind of thinking you'd subject any man-made doctrine to. It is given to us to learn from, period. Everything else you can dissect and criticize, but not God's word.
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ringo Member (Idle past 440 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
Why would you believe that? If you believe the Bible is God's inspired word to us, you don't treat it as man-made by subjecting it to the kind of thinking you'd subject any man-made doctrine to.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1472 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I didn't want to take that ridiculous test when you posted it the first time and I still don't. It seems to be a bunch of opinions specifically collected from people chosen to have IQs below 80. Here's statement #1:
The established authorities generally turn out to be right about things, while the radicals and protestors are usually just "loudmouths showing off their ignorance. Both parts of that statement give me a sort of nausea. WHAT "established authorities?" It depends on what office they're in, and their political views among other things, and some of them with views I might otherwise agree with are complete idiots. Some protestors are protesting the right things for the right reasons, some are protesting for the wrong reasons, some are getting paid to disrupt town hall meetings and the Kavanaugh hearings. What does "usually" mean?
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1052 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined: |
Why not take Bob Altemeyer's test? Aside from the fact that the test looks really badly designed, it's also trying to test something different that what Tangle and Faith were arguing about. Not sure what this would resolve.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Tangle writes: Unless the alleged supernatural Being provided a method where humanity could interact with it. You know the story.
Quite apart from the fact that the thing you call god doesn't exist, there is no way you could know a supernatural being if it did. Tangle writes: Fine. Subjective unverifiable experience then. And I then resort to the Appeal To Popularity. Critics seem to equate belief in God as a belief that is as irrational as belief in Odin, or Spaghetti Monsters or Bigfoots. But when was the last time you even heard an argument from *anyone* defending the viability of a premise that any of them existed? Why is it a logical fallacy to invoke popularity? Surely the fact that so many seek to defend Christianity somehow correlates to a reason why it is something worth defending.
Maybe it would help if you stopped using the word 'evidence' when you're saying that things are subjective and impersonal it would help.Tangle writes: yes. I know. But it is more than blind chance, in my opinion. Christianity won't go away anytime soon...despite your hopes. When society breaks, rationality goes out the window. And don't accuse me of wanting chaos to occur. I will argue that it is cyclical and inevitable. That's not evidence of anything other than you personally believe something. Billions of people believe billions of dumb things, you don't believe most of them, but they do. When I say things like that you just shrug, it doesn't seem to matter to you that what you believe has nothing to do with anything other than the time and place you were born. The closer that humanity gets to a godless society, the closer we also get to extinction. Odd that. On a side note from the "other side" note this interaction between Matt Dillahunty and his fundamentalist parents. It explains to me why people like Theodoric hate Christianity so much.
Edited by Thugpreacha, : No reason given. Edited by Thugpreacha, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8563 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 4.7
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Why is it a logical fallacy to invoke popularity? Surely the fact that so many seek to defend Christianity somehow correlates to a reason why it is something worth defending. Are you sure you want to go here? Remember that a vast majority of the people on this planet reject your version of a god. If this were an election you would lose.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9512 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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Phat writes:
Yeh well, we're all still waiting for that.
Unless the alleged supernatural Being provided a method where humanity could interact with it. You know the story.
Yes, it's a story. One of many.
And I then resort to the Appeal To Popularity. Which you would, of course, lose. So that's that then?
Critics seem to equate belief in God as a belief that is as irrational as belief in Odin, or Spaghetti Monsters or Bigfoots. And so it is.
But when was the last time you even heard an argument from *anyone* defending the viability of a premise that any of them existed? Believers in all sorts of irrational stuff exist. I'm sure there's a load of Odin worshipers out there somewhere that will happily tell you their argument. As I say, people will believe in anything.
Why is it a logical fallacy to invoke popularity? Surely the fact that so many seek to defend Christianity somehow correlates to a reason why it is something worth defending. Because it's a fallacy. You know, something that is an error of logic? The billions that believe in Vishnu doesn't make him exist. To you, does Vishnu exist - he's very popular? Why is your particular god any different?
yes. I know. But it is more than blind chance, in my opinion. If you only believe what you believe because you were born where and when you were, how can it not be chance?
Christianity won't go away anytime soon...despite your hopes. Christianity as a fundie religion is fading fast. It'll probably never fully disappear, there will always be nut jobs that need it.
When society breaks, rationality goes out the window. And don't accuse me of wanting chaos to occur. I will argue that it is cyclical and inevitable. Societies 'break' all the time. Then they rebuild or get consumed by others. It's normal. Read history. It's not the end of the world, it's the human condition. We're trying to modify it and it's not going to work by praying for it.
The closer that humanity gets to a godless society, the closer we also get to extinction. Odd that. What utter crap. The Middle East is riddled with fundy religions and look at the sate of it. The more developed a society gets the more stable it gets and the more capable it is of solving its problems in a sane manner. The world is in a far better state than it's ever been. If you guys are not actually wanting the world to come to an end you're claiming that it is. It's crap; you're part of the problem, not the solution.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9199 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.2
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The logical fallacies are strong in this one.
Critics seem to equate belief in God as a belief that is as irrational as belief in Odin, or Spaghetti Monsters or Bigfoots. But when was the last time you even heard an argument from *anyone* defending the viability of a premise that any of them existed? 成人综合婷婷五月激情综合-国产AV天堂亚洲国产AV刚刚碰一-丝袜好紧…我要让麻麻舒服-国产尤物网站尤物AV在线看 There are many people that profess a belief in Bigfoot. Pastafarianism is a religion that has lots of followers. Are you saying their beliefs are not worthy of respect, because you think their beliefs are silly?Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster Self awareness does not seem a requirement in order to be a fundie. Are there any other beliefs you want to insult, just becaue they are not your christian beliefs?Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Diomedes Member Posts: 996 From: Central Florida, USA Joined:
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Critics seem to equate belief in God as a belief that is as irrational as belief in Odin, or Spaghetti Monsters or Bigfoots. But when was the last time you even heard an argument from *anyone* defending the viability of a premise that any of them existed?
成人综合婷婷五月激情综合-国产AV天堂亚洲国产AV刚刚碰一-丝袜好紧…我要让麻麻舒服-国产尤物网站尤物AV在线看There are many people that profess a belief in Bigfoot. Pastafarianism is a religion that has lots of followers. Are you saying their beliefs are not worthy of respect, because you think their beliefs are silly?Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster Let me add one more to the pot: Hellenion Those are Greek pagans, who still worship the ancient gods such as Zeus, Apollo, Hera, etc. They even had to fight in Greece to get their religion recognized by court order:Greek Paganism legally recognized as 'known religion' in Greece - News, World
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