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Author Topic:   Are Scientists Abandoning Evolution?
NosyNed
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Posts: 9004
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 53 of 82 (212648)
05-30-2005 1:28 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by randman
05-30-2005 12:57 PM


What is an "observation"?
Just the fact that's what the researchers indicate that is what they believe is going on.
The word most often used is "observation". It seems in a lot of the literature this is used interchangably with "measurement". That is, if a macroscopic measurement is made the "weird" QM behavior vanishes. The measurement does not have to be read out right away.
The experiments you describe all have measureing devices that are capable of interferring with the results. If you call haveing a macroscopic interaction with the system under test an observation then no intelligence is involved in "collapsing the wave function".
Remember that the wave function is just as much a mathematical device to prodcue very accurate predications as using math with backwards in time traveling influences. Neither of them may describe what is "really" going on(whatever "really" means) but as long as they work then no problem.
Green in "The Fabric of the Cosmos" suggests that time doesn't flow at all. That it is all "there" in some way. With that view then going backwards in time doesn't sound so nuts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by randman, posted 05-30-2005 12:57 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
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NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9004
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 73 of 82 (212903)
05-31-2005 6:51 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by randman
05-31-2005 1:42 PM


physics bearing on biology
Are you claiming the field of physics has no bearing at all on the field of biology?
For all practical purposes it does not.
You'd think there would be an even more direct connection between physics at the quantum mechanical level and something like structural engineering. However, you may astonish me by showing that engineers use quantum mechanics to determine the appropriate load bearing material when building a bridge. In fact that level of physics is ignored.
When solving problems or thinking about a specific area it is important to set the levels of abstraction correctly. Population genetics does not worry about the precise chemistry of DNA much less the physics of the interaction of molecules.
Your suggesting a meaningful tie is an example of erroneous thinking of a very fundamental nature.
If you wish to suggest, on the other hand, that the laws of the universe were designed by some self-aware force to produce the possibility of life like ourselves evolving then you are free to do so. You may even choose to make this a foundation stone of your faith. There is no way to support or falsify such an idea at present. We don't know why the laws of the universe are as they are.
This view is a philosophical one which isn't something having anything at all to do with biology and the evolutionary ideas contained there.
Of course, if you choose to build your faith on such foundational assumptions then you are at risk of having the foundation shattered at some future date. That puts you in the same position as those who have faith resting on the sand of a literal genesis.

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