Some Specific Biblical Prophecies

It is hard to attribute your insistence that "awesome" (which is more emphatic) did not imply "impressive" as a mistake.But lets start with this one. How do you answer the suggestion that the author of Luke may have added the words of 21:24 to the Olivet discourse ?You denied that it was based on a simple assumption that Luke's gospel must accurately report what Jesus said, yet have refused to oexplain what else "you have the saviors words and then you have the exile happening" could mean.IF your denial was a "mistake" then a correction and apology are in order - not suddenly refusing to talk about the subject. If your claim was true then the correct response would have been to explain what you did mean.

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But lets start with this one. How do you answer the suggestion that the author of Luke may have added the words of 21:24 to the Olivet discourse ?

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I dont think anyone may prove that he did or didn't. I will say that I am a LDS and everything I approach is approached with the understanding of LDS philosphy so it may not match those which you are aiming at. To me all scripture is good for proof and re-proofing as it stats in the bible. I would say as long as the translation is done by a prophet of God I have no problems with the book of Luke. Now if luke was translated by any other person I do because I believe outside of the LDS doctrine the bible does not do so well on its own.

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You denied that it was based on a simple assumption that Luke's gospel must accurately report what Jesus said, yet have refused to oexplain what else "you have the saviors words and then you have the exile happening" could mean.

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You have to see and understand who God of the Old Testament is before you can say this is not his words if you knew the God of the Old Testament according to scripture you would see how this is his words as he repeats them time and time again in the Old Testament and not just talking about the Old Testament dispenation but also talking about the last days, ie, our time.(the new dispensation)so you see I think that it is fine, I dont think it was added this is why.If you understand the bible, Israel was a good people one time then became very bad and transgressed the laws and as you have seen in the OT god has been very harsh to those who transgress the laws and he used Israel to correct those issues in the Old Testament as you have seen.
Because of this I would assume the role that God is not going to change and is now going to be Harsh on them, Very harsh but also through this he promised them he would rememeber them because
of there faith in the begining, ie when Abraham and Moses were there leaders, etc.If you read Genesis 28:14 you may notice that it has already blessed them by saying all the world will be blessed in their seed so this is just about the begining of many things to come
he is already talking about scattering them across the world but to bless them rather then to destroy them."And thy seed shall be as the dust of the earth, and thou shalt spread abroad to the west, and to the east, and to the north, and to the south: and in thee and in thy seed shall all the families of the earth be blessed."Leveticus 22:33"That brought you out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: I [am] the LORD."
You also see that God loves Israel as a people he brought them out of Egypt and saved them from bondage, if you think about it this is just about what would have happend to the remainders of the jews in the destruction of jarusalem in 70ad if the scattering didn't take place, Jews, all Jews left would have been back in bondage in the destruction of the temple and would eventally no longer been Jews, in this way god saved them but at the same time he punished them because of all the other things that happend to them while they where away from there home, on top of that it was a prediction by the messiah. (i.e Luke 21:24)Here you see the LORD warn Israel that if they become evil in his eyes he will parish them and scatter them. Then he goes on to say that they will become evil and that he will scatter them and when he scatters them they will come across many nations and many graven images and they will serve those images (i.e. idols) but if they search hard and pray hard they will find him (so he didn't leave them alone he lead them into captivity because they became captive, they didn't obstain from the wickid ways so he gave them what they wanted in other words and by doing they where also punished)But then he goes on to speak about the last days about how they will go through the same thing again and how he will be there for them again because he remembers the covenant he made with their fathers.
deut 4:23-31
"Take heed unto yourselves, lest ye forget the covenant of the LORD your God, which he made with you, and make you a graven image, [or] the likeness of any [thing], which the LORD thy God hath forbidden thee.
For the LORD thy God [is] a consuming fire, [even] a jealous God.
When thou shalt beget children, and children's children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt [yourselves], and make a graven image, [or] the likeness of any [thing], and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger:
When thou shalt beget children, and children's children, and ye shall have remained long in the land, and shall corrupt [yourselves], and make a graven image, [or] the likeness of any [thing], and shall do evil in the sight of the LORD thy God, to provoke him to anger:
I call heaven and earth to witness against you this day, that ye shall soon utterly perish from off the land whereunto ye go over Jordan to possess it; ye shall not prolong [your] days upon it, but shall utterly be destroyed.
And the LORD shall scatter you among the nations, and ye shall be left few in number among the heathen, whither the LORD shall lead you.
And there ye shall serve gods, the work of men's hands, wood and stone, which neither see, nor hear, nor eat, nor smell.
But if from thence thou shalt seek the LORD thy God, thou shalt find [him], if thou seek him with all thy heart and with all thy soul.
When thou art in tribulation, and all these things are come upon thee, [even] in the latter days, if thou turn to the LORD thy God, and shalt be obedient unto his voice;
(For the LORD thy God [is] a merciful God he will not forsake thee, neither destroy thee, nor forget the covenant of thy fathers which he sware unto them."Then again in Nehemiah 1:8-9
"He then talks again about how if they forget or break the laws he will scatter them. and if they do and keep his commandments he will gather them. So this time he does not only talk about scattering them but also gathering them. That seems like what happend, they where scatterd and now they are being gatherd yet once again.
Remember, I beseech thee, the word that thou commandedst thy servant Moses, saying, [If] ye transgress, I will scatter you abroad among the nations:
But [if] ye turn unto me, and keep my commandments, and do them; though there were of you cast out unto the uttermost part of the heaven, [yet] will I gather them from thence, and will bring them unto the place that I have chosen to set my name there. "
deut 28:64
Once again he talks about scattering them and how they shalt serve greater images ie. idols.
"And the LORD shall scatter thee among all people, from the one end of the earth even unto the other; and there thou shalt serve other gods, which neither thou nor thy fathers have known, [even] wood and stone. "
1 kings 22:17
and now we see the lord gathering them again.
"And he said, I saw all Israel scattered upon the hills, as sheep that have not a shepherd: and the LORD said, These have no master: let them return every man to his house in peace."
Rom 11:15
we see him talking about one of the reasons it was good to cast them out
For if the casting away of them [be] the reconciling of the world, what [shall] the receiving [of them be], but life from the dead?
So you see it is a pattern of israel to be good then evil, god cast them out, they go good then back to evil, but you see this is the last time because this time they
have a savior who has saved them, along with the rest of the world because he has atoned for the sins of the world.So you see the fact that luke 21:24 says that they will be lead awey captive does not sound new or made up to now that I understand who god is, and also he will bring them back because it says untill the times of the gentiles so to me this sounds like the same god of the old testament so to me I would say this is something the savior said. It does not matter if Matt and mark didn't account for this as this is normal sometimes god wants certain people to account for certain things take for example there being only 2 records both differnt in nature but only 2 records still in all 4 gospels. The fact that luke is the only person who talked about them being lead away does not make me think it is a opinion of his. This is for sure in my mind something the savior said. "I ask, what if the savior asked Luke tobe the only one to write this down?" he may not have but what if he did? how do you feel about that?Now look at it and tell me what you think.
(And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled)Anymore questions?-Quiz

Buz writes:11. JESUS'S REMARKABLE PROPHECY FULFILLED TO THE "T" some 19 CENTURIES AFTER THE PROPHECY GIVEN!!

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Apart from the fact that your statement looks like a headline for the Weekly World News

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ROTFLMAO!!!!

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also note if the prophecy where to end in that generation as you say the scripture is telling "us" then as you say the savior would have come again already, but he has not.

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A comparative reading of the Gospels also shows that as time passed and it became clear that Jesus wasn't coming back any time soon, contrary to his assurances that he would, he is written about as being a redeemer of soulls for eternity.Before that, he was going to be a literal king on earth, having defeated all of the Jew's enemies. The messiah was not originally a spiritual leader, but a military one.

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It's only redundant and goofy if you choose to ignore the clear prophetic nature of the text.

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"You shall see the rain when it starts to rain" isn't a goofy statement?

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I'm fully aware that the ideology of you secularists is at stake here,

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Don't flatter yourself, Buz.

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so it's to your all's edeological advantage in this debate to keep this just as reduntant and goofy as you possibly can.

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Is that your best response?Buzsaw: "It's not goofy and redundant because...it just ISN'T!"

You obviously have not read the entire thread, the generation is not the a literal generation it is ment to be dispensation. wow. you need help. laugh-Quiz

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Schraf has requested several prophecies to show the Bible to be supernatural. I believe this one has been shown to be fulfilled, but as I said, the ideologies of most of you stand or fall on whether it is indeed a bonafide fulfilled prophecy. I understand why you go to the lengths you do to discredit it. The text and history, nevertheless speak for themselves. Rather than go with another prophecy here, I'll soon do another one on another thread as this one is too lengthy, imo to extend into another subject. Feel free to add more input here, but I've alloted all the time I'm gona on responding to all the same yada on the generation thing.

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...and he bows out, having declared that he is right without having adequately answered the criticisms of his argument.Gee, that's not like buz at all!

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The only way you can do that is if you prove that Joseph F Smith is false prophet.

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What sort of evidence would you accept?

Hi, Of course it has, it was for the generation alive at that time, are you saying that the generation alive in 1967 were all less that 4 years old! You are as desparate as Buz. Where are your critical thinkking skills? You really don't seem to understand what this is about at all do you?A generation 'passes' because another generation has been born, not because the entire generation has died out (passed), a generationis replaced by another generation, on average nowadays of around 30 years.You have to get this idea out your head that the passing of a generation means that a generation has all died off. Have you never complained about the younger generation, or moaned about the older generation?And yes, the passing of a generation could be ten years, if these signs were completed during the last decade of a generation then the second coming would be in less than ten years. So your time has passed, Jesus is a failure yet again.So can you prove that no one has been born in Israel since 1967?I really think that this is all academic anyway, the prophecy clearly relates to the generation alive in Jesus' time. Jesus didn't just fail, his 'prophecy' is embarrassing. Well he says it is scary, it isnt scary for me so that only leaves him I disagree, Christians are scared out of their wits by the Hell fantasy that their only motive for following Jesus is to save their own skins, how else to you explain the intellectual contortions that they go through to deny reality? Well Christianity is lame, it is a absurd to live inside a 2000 year old myth as if it is actually real, even worse, it is cruel to mentally abuse children with this abomination. I hope you are still saying this as Allah lobs you into the pit for worshipping false idols ! LOLWhat a joke.Brian.

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wow. you need help. laugh

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wow. Your response had nothing to do with my comment.

OK, so you DO assume that the Gospel of Luke is accurate just as I said, and your denial was a lie. Now the fact is that there are good reasons to suspect an addition, and the evidence points to Luke being written after the exile.

Your position is fairly clear, and I have no interest in trying to change your mind nor to air the details of the events leading up to the Six Day War. My original point was that I think assigning responsibility for causing a war to the initiator of hostilities is over-simplistic. I would note that you've put a strongly pro-Arab spin on the events you've mentioned so far. For instance you say, sure, Nasser blockaded the Gulf of Aqaba, but the US does blockades all the time, so what! You say that the military buildup was on *both* sides, when it was actually Arab forces which first massed on Israel's border. You declare Israel's April 7th strike on Syria the first "militarily-significant event" while ignoring that it was in retaliation for Syrian shelling of Israel from the Golan Heights, perhaps because to you shelling is a militarily-insignificant event.The causes of the Six Day War are deeply rooted and complex and render the immediately preceding events mere incidentals. The origins lie in the purchase of Arab land by Jews in the 19th century, in attitudes of European powers toward their Middle
Eastern colonies, in Hitler's extermination of the Jews in Europe which led to making finding a homeland for the Jews a high priority after WWII, and in Arab hostility toward Israel that has been unceasing and unrelenting ever since Israel's establishment.I mention these things only to indicate that I'm not pleading nolo contendere - my lack of interest in pursuing the issues you raise is simply because discussing wars isn't one of my interests. As I've already said, I had a more general point. I think your approach to blaming Israel is over-simplistic.My own view is that it is rare in human affairs when fault lies almost solely on one side, and that the Six Day War is no exception.--Percy

Hi Quiz,Buzsaw's contention in the OP is very specific. He emphatically proclaims that the 1967 six-day war was the event prophesied in Luke 21:24(b).

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Luke 21:24(b)

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. . . and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

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If this prophecy was fulfilled in the six-day war, then the "times of the Gentiles" came to an end in 1967.

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Mormon (LDS) publication, "Doctrine and Covenants"

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Christ taught that in that generation when the Gentiles will no longer receive the gospel, "for they perceive not the light, and they turn their hearts from me because of the precepts of men..., the times of the Gentiles [will] be fulfilled. (D&C 45:29.)

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According to your advocated LDS doctrine, the times of the Gentiles will be fulfilled when the Gentiles no longer receive the gospel.

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Originally posted by buzsaw

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JESUS'S REMARKABLE PROPHECY FULFILLED TO THE "T" some 19 CENTURIES AFTER THE PROPHECY GIVEN!!

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Again, buzsaw's contention is that the prophecy of Luke 21:24 was specifically fulfilled by the 1967 six-day war. Thus, according to your advocated LDS doctrine, he is saying that the Gentiles stopped receiving the gospel in 1967.

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Originally posted by Quiz

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I dont think it is the end of the this dispensation, I agree that the Jews are established as a nation again. Now they are working on re-building the Temple which is another prophecy.

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This is mere equivocation. What I am specifically asking you is:Do you agree with buzsaw that the "times of the Gentiles" ended in 1967 and thus, that the gentiles stopped receiving the gospel at this time?OR:Do you (along with myself and others) disagree with buzsaw's emphatic contention that the 1967 six-day war was the "REMARKABLE PROPHECY (of Luke 21:24) FULFILLED TO THE 'T' some 19 CENTURIES AFTER THE PROPHECY (was) GIVEN!!"?It either was, or it wasn't. What is your position?Namaste'Amlodhi

I have to agree with Percy. The whole mess in the middle east isn't simple. Both sides have been and are still behaving badly and stupidly. Untangling it now isn't easy and they all need to just get on with moving away from where they are.

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OK, so you DO assume that the Gospel of Luke is accurate just as I said, and your denial was a lie. Now the fact is that there are good reasons to suspect an addition, and the evidence points to Luke being written after the exile.

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Ok, I lied! laugh, no. I missunderstood, You need to give people the benefit of the doubt as most are not as bad as you are assuming they are.Show me the money-Quiz