Human Programming

I think it is a well-known fact that where you are born is an extremely strong factor as to what religious belief you will adhere too. If you grow up in a Muslim family, you will most likely be Muslim. I think the average Joe is pretty much aware of that.The belief most of us defend so vehemently is nothing else then the belief of our parents or in some case, our friend or a social group we belong too.So on one side we have the Christian, on the other a Muslim. Both defend there religious belief, and both disagree with the other based on what? Based on a programming they received when they were young.Let’s take a step back for a second. We know that both sides’ claims are pretty similar.
They both have stories about people converting to there religion after having an incredible experience that leaves no doubt on the validity of the said religion. But how can one be certain? How can one know for sure that they just weren’t born in the wrong place?The only way of being certain is to use the brain we have to figure out as much as we can with the data we’re presented with. I mean, everyone can agree that the best way to understand our environment (and ourselves) is to study it, to ask question, to try and know why and how. We’ve seen countless of time what dogmatic belief can do, if we all followed what we were taught without asking question, the earth would still be flat, it would still be the center of the universe, and we would stone people who work on Sundays.How can a scholar believe in a book written hundreds of years ago without even questioning the validity of the book. How can someone follow so blindly a belief just because that’s what everyone around him taught to be true.Fear of death and ignoranceFire, wind, water, earth. There was a time when we didn’t quite understand theses, and we labeled them gods out of ignorance.I myself don’t believe in any religion, being the son of a muslim father and a Christian mother (both not practicing though) I’ve never really been programmed into believing in god.I want to know what makes you believe you are right? What drives you to defend your belief?would it be by any chance simply because you were conditioned your whole life ?

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Like all maps, they must be tested constantly against reality and where they do not correspond with reality, questioned.

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Test it against reality. But wich reality?See I think once your conditioned, you start distorting how you percieve the world around you. To a christian a small coicidence is taken as proof of the validity of the bible, while a huge contradiction is looked over.And most of them think I am totally crazy. How can't I believe in god (what they mean is in the bible and in everything the bible say).Well I'd like to point out that they woulnt either if they were born in a different family, with different beliefs...

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I grew up indoctrinated to be a christian fundamentalist. So, I'd say that from my earliest memories to my late teen years I was constantly being reminded of god by family and community.
  —gasby

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If you don't mind i'll ask some personal questions.How is relations with your family now ?
How is it that you didn't make excuses up or simply put, why aren't you like so many religious people..in denial of reality as perceived by science ?
And do you miss/regret anything ? (maybe the appartenance of a group of people )

Jar,I read your post but couldn't reply since it was closed.On what you base your belief that we need to be saved?
Do you think it is simply because you were told so, or do you came up with it from data you gathered around you ?I know I ask a lot of question, but it help me understand

Sorry, you're right, I just assumed that in general it is the other way around. I agree totally, there is no way to be sure, and that what's faith is all about. But you said something I wasnt sure I understood. When you say it IS true, you meant you think it is true. Taking into consideration your knowledge and your experience. But saying that is IS true, is like saying that you are certain of your belief. Can I ask, what in your research made you decide that christianity was the truth, is it personal or is it something anybody could go through and find the same answer?

Comfort reason..I talked witha good friend of mine, who is a strong believer. After hours of debate (friendly debate mind you) he came up with a similar answer."Because christianity is the only possible working religion"To him, he already believed so deeply that he was imperfect and not worthy of god, that it was second nature to him. And with that assumption, how can any other religion work ? If jesus isn't here to save you.It was simply comfortable to stay in the same mindset.Sometimes I wish I was raised by religious parent, it sure would make things easier for me Having the feeling to know is a comforting feeling..

Jar sorry about the misunderstanding I know you didnt say that.. I was just recalling a conversation I had with my friend..The similarity with what you said in a previous post was simply the comfort a belief gives you.

So if I go a little bit further in your train of though, we are all programmed to seek the truth with little or no influence from our environment ? I don't think I said I found any hate in my church, since I've never been part of any church to begin with. Although I do think that there is much hatred in a lot of religions.

Human programming.If I said that the bible isn't a verifiable source of information (Like most scientist tend to conclude) can someone who strongly believe in the bible can tell me why do they say otherwise?Keep in mind that nobody refutes scientist when it comes to:
-our solar system
-gravity
-the law of physics
-etc..I want to know what make you decide that scientific around the world are wrong on this specific subject?And try to see the larger picture, in term of numbers, we mean nothing alone, there is millions of people adhering to a different religions then yours. And they believe as strongly as you that their religion is the truth.My answer to this is human programming.

I believe that who you are is mainly the product of your environment (friends family, school etc..)Of course, we are all born with specific characteristics that makes us different to start with. But it can be tempered with.Most of us believe that in a civilized society, stoning someone is wrong. Although if you were born in a different time, it would be probably easier to accept.

Evidence is something that is evident to the majority of people.I can't really get how can someone firmly believe in god because of the bible (Qu'ran, Tora etc).Is the Tora an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the Qu'ran an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the Bible an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the book of mormont an evidence for God ? of course not
Is the book of scientology an evidence for an alien life ? of course not
Is our ignorance an evidence of a creator ? of course notSo if we exclude theses books, what do you base your belief on ?Edited by Kader, : No reason given.

Catholic Scientistyou know that as we speak there are people born in family with strong belief in scientology lets say. Theses childrens will be indoctrined in a beleif that is based on NO evidence at all.But to them it is quite evident.why is that ?
How can they believe so firmly into something simply because someone told them it was so, without bringing up any evidence. Its like saying almost everyone believe in god thus, god must exist.
You never questioned yourself as to why it is an evidence for you?An evidence is not something personal. If its evident only to you, then it is not an evidence.as quoted from wiki :
Evidence in its broadest sense, refers to anything that is used to determine or demonstrate the truth of an assertion.

Yes Faith.Faith is a belief, trust, or confidence, not based merely on logic, reason, or empirical data, but based fundamentally on volition often associated with a transpersonal relationship with God, a higher power, a person, elements of nature, and/or a perception of the human race as a wholeFaith is something in wich we believe with no need for facts or evidence.If I was speaking to a scientologue and told him there is NO evidence whatsoever about the existance of any super evil alien sending soul on earth. Well he would tell me im crazy to question his beliefs.And why does he believe ?? well its because everything makes sense (to him), it is evident!!But we could safely say that he was programmed to believe in something that defy every LOGIC. Im sorry if I mistook your words, but you said that individually every religious book (hence every religions) is a small evidence of gods existence. So I the meaning I got out of is was --> because there is people believing in theses books (religions) it makes the existance of God more probable.I beg to differ, non of theses religious book is any evidence to God's existence. Although I agree with you, it is evident to the followers of each religions, but it is not an evidence. As I said earlier, im sorry but if to me it was evident that the earth is flat doesnt make it an evidence.. you follow my train of thoughts ?

Religions exist because we can't answers critical questions.In ancient time, gods were simply manifestation of nature that we did not understand.It is human nature to try and understand everything around us. It is human nature to ask questions. When questions find no answers, we most often then not, make some up to fill the gap.Ignorance isn't something easy to live with.ps : did you see my message 60 ? I dunno how to link it though

Being honest start with verifying the assertions.Does the [insert any religious book] assertion are in concordance with what I see around me ?Have the fact that I have been repeated again and again some concept distorted my views of reality ?and most importantly..Why do I beleive ?The last questionned seem to be shrigged off by too many people. Or the answers often illogical.