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Author Topic:   The Big C: Circumcision
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 86 of 104 (49187)
08-07-2003 4:19 PM
Reply to: Message 78 by nator
08-06-2003 11:53 PM


I most certainly do object to anyone thinking they have the right to mess about with my nether regions without getting my approval!
Well, I think you find that when it's already happened to you, and you have no memory of it, and it hasn't caused any perceptible loss of function, you don't really mind. At least that's my experience and the vast experience of circumcised men.
Tell me, crashfrog, what do you think of footbinding?
Sounds painfully and permanently debilitating. So I guess I'm opposed. Why, what did you think I would say?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 78 by nator, posted 08-06-2003 11:53 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 89 by Rrhain, posted 08-07-2003 5:35 PM crashfrog has replied
 Message 93 by nator, posted 08-07-2003 7:19 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 87 of 104 (49189)
08-07-2003 4:25 PM
Reply to: Message 79 by greyline
08-07-2003 12:02 AM


I was going to suggest that crashfrog repeat his above comment to the women in his life - his sisters, mother, colleagues, wife, girlfriend, etc. and see what kind of response it drew!
Upon doing exactly that, I discovered that my wife at least felt that a token snip of the labia, performed at birth and entailing no alteration of function later in life, was not that big a deal.
I have no reason to suspect that my wife is alone in this assessment, I guess.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 79 by greyline, posted 08-07-2003 12:02 AM greyline has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 88 by Rrhain, posted 08-07-2003 5:33 PM crashfrog has not replied
 Message 96 by greyline, posted 08-08-2003 4:56 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 90 of 104 (49236)
08-07-2003 5:42 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by Rrhain
08-07-2003 5:35 PM


The general consensus from those who have had their foreskins removed later in life and can tell the difference is that having a foreskin is better.
Then why do people opt for the procedure? For that matter, how many people in your sample can't tell the difference?
And why do men without foreskins have more sex, and report greater satisfaction with their sex lives?
As has been mentioned, America has the greatest incidence of circumcision in men. Americans have the most sex, on average, of any nation on Earth. Now, I'm not trying to argue causality, but I find that may be indicative of something.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by Rrhain, posted 08-07-2003 5:35 PM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 91 by Rrhain, posted 08-07-2003 5:46 PM crashfrog has replied
 Message 94 by nator, posted 08-07-2003 7:31 PM crashfrog has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 92 of 104 (49250)
08-07-2003 6:18 PM
Reply to: Message 91 by Rrhain
08-07-2003 5:46 PM


Well, in trying to find the pro-circumcision studies I once had, I've more or less found a vast weight of data suggesting that I'm wrong about it.
So, I'll let my sons decide for themselves, I guess. No circumcisions for them unless they tell me they want them.
But neither am I going to get upset because I was myself circumcised. Of all the things my parents may have done to me, that had probably the least effect on my life.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 91 by Rrhain, posted 08-07-2003 5:46 PM Rrhain has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 99 by Zealot, posted 09-09-2003 12:07 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 95 of 104 (49301)
08-08-2003 12:29 AM
Reply to: Message 93 by nator
08-07-2003 7:19 PM


Basically, I just told you I would mind, but somehow you seem to think that the opposite is actually how I really feel.
What part of, "I would very much mind!" don't you understand?
Sorry, I guess I meant "you" in the general sense of "a person", not you specifically. Plenty of men don't mind their circumcisions. Ergo it's probably the case for plenty of people that if they don't have something, and never did, they don't miss it.
It wasn't my intent to dictate to you what you would or would not mind. But I see that it came off that way. Sorry.
I am more interested in your thoughts about the parents of an infant getting his or her eyelids "fixed" to make them appear less "asian" and more "white". Do you think that's OK?
I'd be more concerned about what kind of culture would cause two people to feel that that was something they needed to have done to their child. With no knowledge of what culture they're in I can't really say whether it's ok or not. But in the culture I'm in, no, that's not ok, it's kind of racist, or even perverse.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 93 by nator, posted 08-07-2003 7:19 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 97 by nator, posted 08-08-2003 7:58 PM crashfrog has replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 98 of 104 (49505)
08-08-2003 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by nator
08-08-2003 7:58 PM


So you have no judgement about the culture in which this hypothetical couple and infant live; a culture in which is it considered "normal" to have white-looking eyes and "abnormal" to have asian-eyes?
No, I'd be openly critical of such a culture. What I can hardly criticise are the two parents in such a culture who are doing precisely what they have always been taught is well and good.
I'm openly critical of our culture, as well. For the reasons that you would suspect.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by nator, posted 08-08-2003 7:58 PM nator has not replied

  
crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1497 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 100 of 104 (54665)
09-10-2003 12:21 AM
Reply to: Message 99 by Zealot
09-09-2003 12:07 PM


I think only in 3rd world countries or countries where regular washing facilities are a shortage is circumcision a benefit, otherwise just tell your kids to give it a good washdown and they'll be alright.
Well, the wife and I are about 10 years away from this being an issue. I can only hope that American society has changed enough that I won't feel like I'm having to choose between a risky medical procedure and years of locker-room insult for him.
But hey, maybe they'll all be girls.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Zealot, posted 09-09-2003 12:07 PM Zealot has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 101 by Zealot, posted 09-10-2003 9:59 AM crashfrog has not replied

  
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