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Author Topic:   The Big C: Circumcision
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5902 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 2 of 104 (34192)
03-12-2003 9:22 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by greyline
03-12-2003 8:26 AM


Male circumcision has the same basis in medical fact as antibiotics for the flu: i.e., none. It does, however, have a very long and hoary tradition. The first recorded evidence of male circumcision comes from Egypt around 2300 BC. Also, the OT has it listed as a "covenant" between Abraham and God (Genesis 17, IIRC), so odds are it was borrowed from earlier, animist or pagan tradition like a lot of the OT. My guess would be it orginated as some kind of rite of passage thingy. There has been a fair amount of religious support for the practice, at least Judeo-Christian tradition. There was a cultural tradition in the US that provided a "medical" reason for it - during the 18th and 19th Centuries circumcision supposedly helped stop masturbation (like that makes sense...), again probably derived from a puritan-type religious stance that masturbation was a bad thing. IOW, from a scientific standpoint there's no medical reason for the practice.
As to the ethics of an infant "owning" its foreskin... Well, I'll let the people who like to argue obscure moral points take that one.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by greyline, posted 03-12-2003 8:26 AM greyline has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by greyline, posted 03-12-2003 4:25 PM Quetzal has replied
 Message 5 by Coragyps, posted 03-13-2003 11:19 AM Quetzal has not replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5902 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 4 of 104 (34275)
03-13-2003 9:52 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by greyline
03-12-2003 4:25 PM


Good Luck!
Hi greyline.
greyline writes:
Is it therefore unethical for parents to consent to a medical procedure, which has certain risks, when there is no medical reason for the procedure?
Is it unethical for a doctor to perform what is essentially cosmetic surgery on a minor, when there is no "default" being corrected?
I guess I was unclear. I think I answered your question concerning the medical reasons (or lack thereof) and added a bit of history of the procedure. I also stated that I had no interest in discussing the ethics of whether a neonate can be considered to "own" his foreskin. By extension, this lack of interest in discussing ethics should be extended to the two questions you posted above. No offense, but I swore off philosophy and metaphysics (a New Year's resolution) because to me most of the discussions appear to de-evolve rapidly into the semantic equivalent of arguing over the square root of a duck. You'll need to find someone else to discuss ethics and morality with on that score. Happy hunting.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by greyline, posted 03-12-2003 4:25 PM greyline has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by greyline, posted 03-13-2003 5:56 PM Quetzal has replied

  
Quetzal
Member (Idle past 5902 days)
Posts: 3228
Joined: 01-09-2002


Message 7 of 104 (34352)
03-14-2003 9:20 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by greyline
03-13-2003 5:56 PM


Re: Good Luck!
Yeah, I kinda figured you wanted to discuss the topic seriously, which is why I backed out. For me, it's an SQR(DUCK) question, but I know it's a hot topic for others. The problem's with me, not the topic.
OTOH, I'm not sure how many takers you'll have here that will argue the "pro-" side of the question, which is why you haven't had huge response, I think.
Anyway, as a peace offering, there's a nice discussion going on over on IIDB at this thread on the topic. You might have more luck over there for this particular conversation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by greyline, posted 03-13-2003 5:56 PM greyline has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by greyline, posted 03-14-2003 9:29 AM Quetzal has not replied

  
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