why DID we evolve into humans?

What does that even mean? First of all, I don't know if somehow you're trying to imply I would beat my wife, not that I'm even married... But if you're actually trying to make a point, you aren't even making sense? Neither of those is true because I don't have a wife... Whatever, sounds like you're trying to be funny, I don't even know..... But as for your next post... You condemn me for calling names? What was wounded king doing in his post? By the way, you're a retard too if you don't see that when he addresses me "rabair" in his post, sounds like he's talking to me, not another poster. Regardless of the fact that I've just found that Syamsu is another poster... he was still talking to me and implying some BS about nothing, and he wasn't even involved. He jumps in, expecting me to know who this other poster is from another board, and wants to get accuse me of crap when I'm making a little crack to you about how there isn't "more true" and "less true." I obviously knew what you meant when you originally stated something being "more true" than things I believe are facts... I'll go back again, and say, I never claimed other things that I think are facts, ya'll did..... I questioned your "facts"... But the point was, I knew what you meant by "more true", but I wanted to correct you so you don't use that phrase because it is inaccurate. Althought I don't agree, I know you obviously meant you feel that there is more evidence towards your beliefs. The point is that was obvious and then wounded came in acting like an idiot. Now, I've dealt with idiots like you on here before too. HAVE I EVER MENTIONED GOD? No, so shut the fu** up about it. It is such the evolutionist way out to say stupid things like that to feel condescending.... Don't give me sh** about "witnessing." Have I attempted to witness? NO, I didn't think so, it is so ridiculous that most of you can't avoid making stupid predictable comments like that. I'm sorry mommy and daddy made you go to church as a kid, and now you feel it was all a wash, so you feel compelled to say things like that. Grow up child...[This message has been edited by rabair, 09-11-2003]

Right, but if there's only things that are true, and things that are false, then for any two opposite statements, one of them must be true and the other must be false.It's your position that things are either true or false; there's no middle ground. If that's the case than you should be able to tell me which of those two statements is the true one.On the other hand, if neither of them are true, then you have to grant that there's intermediate levels of truth. Asking you if you believed iin "truth" or not. Some people (like Syamsu) appear not to. He wasn't calling you anything. It's a public board. Anyone can play. If you don't like that, then you can take your ball and go home. Christians witness in every action they make. I should know, I was one. And what you're giving witness to is that creationists rely on swearing and name-calling when they get backed into a corner. Now, I don't know that you're a Christian, but most people who take a creationist view are. If you're not a Christian, just say so. But if you are, shouldn't you be acting like one? I'm just curious.Now, remember how we (well, me) were talking about how "theory" doesn't mean "guess"? Are you prepared to address this oversight of yours or not? Or should we assume that when you say "evolution is just a theory" you mean to say that it's a verified and accurate scientific model? That's what a "theory" is in this context, after all.

rabair, If you bothered to read the last paragraph in my post you would realise I'm not disagreeing with you, but Wounded. And you call him an idiot? Outstanding, rabair, outstanding.The person that claims not to have said something, & then has three separate quotes made where he DID say that thing should be more careful who he calls a "retard" & an "idiot", wouldn't you say?Mark------------------
"I can't prove creationism, but they can't prove evolution. It is [also] a religion, so it should not be taught....Christians took over the school board and voted in creationism. That can be done in any school district anywhere, and it ought to be done." Says Kent "consistent" Hovind in "Unmasking the False Religion of Evolution Chapter 6."

I'm glad to see you don't let your ignorance deter you from voicing your stupidity, these boards would be so much duller if people thought before they posted. Having got the apparently obligatory personal abuse out of the way.As has been pointed out, Syamsu is another poster on these forums. The fact that you don't understand what I am saying does not make what I said stupid, it just shows your lack of comprehension.I'm not claiming there is a spectrum of varying degrees of truth. I'm quite happy to stipulate that things are either true or false. All I am saying is that something which is False is less true, 100% less true in fact, than something which is True.If you want a one on one dialogue with someone why don't you start one in the Great Debate forum.

I will apologize for the name calling to Mark and Wounded... But I still point out that wounded was throwing around a lot of names... He may have been saying them about Syamsu, but still the point was he was implying I somehow hold some views of Syamsu. The problem is, I didn't know who Syamsu was... Nor should I have an obligation to know what you're talking about when you say that. I don't think it's neccessary to go searching through posts everytime I don't know a certain word, to see if it (Syamsu) is the name of another poster. Had Syamsu been involved in this post, it may have made a little more sense. Expect anger when you imply that I would call someone a Nazi because this Syamsu guy may have said something like that. That's out of line when just I pointed out that there aren't different levels of truth, which you obviously agree with.And Mark, While you say your last sentence agreed with me.... Obviously, because it is something that isn't really debatable, but the point is you threw your arms around Wounded when he said nothing to do with what you and I had been discussing... He made implications comparing me to this Syamsu guy, and you're all "Over to you mate..." And you go on to degrade stuff from your's and my discussion, which isn't called for. Even if Wounded had come to debate the same thing, it wouldn't be called for, but the point is, wounded was responding to a little off-shoot where I was telling Crash that "more trues" and "less trues" really don't exist. I'll elaborate on that really quickly here too... I think Crash means to say "more probable" and "less probable", when something isn't an absolute. I had no ill will when pointing that out to Crash, but then I've got Wounded coming in assuming I should know what he's talking about when mentioning someone from another post, and using harsh words, then Crash bringing religion in, which I will compliment you (Mark), for not doing, because that is just an easy out and a ridiculous mistake made by too many on your side.I will only say one thing to Crash... Whatever, it's obvious there isn't "more true" and "less true", I'm done with that... But it's obvious your anger at christianity. You say that "Now, I don't know that you're a Christian, but most people who take a creationist view are".... Could you have made a more stupid statement? Why don't you add up every other religion aside from Christianity and rethink your statement. You talk about every action being witnessing? So the big crap I just took was to witness to the Nashville sewer system? And you say shouldn't I be acting like one? Number one, your definition of what a christian acts like is not like anyone else.... I believe Catholics are lazy and hypocritical don't have anything to do with most real christians, but they're like the biggest denomination. Then you have tons of other denominations, each with their own beliefs and laws.... Don't tell me how a christian should act. Just because Mommy and Daddy made you go to church and told you to act a certain way, doesn't mean all Christians are the same. Whatever, you're a waste of my time. Here's some other creationist for you... Jews, Islamists, etc. etc..... Get it, for you to instantly imply that most creationists are Christian just shows your obvious personal problem with the religion.[This message has been edited by rabair, 09-12-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-12-2003]

rabair, I didn't, I said I disagreed with Wounded, or more accurately was attempting to clarify. Let me remind you you had called me a liar, which I wasn't, you had lied yourself, & you had called Wounded a retard & an idiot. "Over to you, mate" is a pretty tame thing to be complaining about, isn't it?I note & accept your apology, & thank you for being big enough to do so. That's my point too. When determining the truth, you can't assume you have it at the beginning. The more evidence you have, the less tentative & more probable it is that you have the truth, or are at least in the right ball park. However, strictly speaking, & this was the only point being made by Wounded, was that something that was true was in fact, more true than something that is false.Anyway, unless you have anything to add that would save your argument from non-sequiturhood, we appear to be done.Mark------------------
"I can't prove creationism, but they can't prove evolution. It is [also] a religion, so it should not be taught....Christians took over the school board and voted in creationism. That can be done in any school district anywhere, and it ought to be done." Says Kent "consistent" Hovind in "Unmasking the False Religion of Evolution Chapter 6."

Actuallly it would be more correct to say I meant "more accurate" or "less accurate", in terms of how accurately certain models (aka "theories") represent reality. Again, my point was to say that those models that you have incorrectly implied are "guesses" are actually more accurate in describing reality than many of the things you probably hold as fact. Probably, because it wasn't a stupid statement. In the English-speaking world, almost every Creationist is a Chrisitian. This is one of the things that most typifies the movement - it's primarily composed of evangelical, Biblically literalist Christians. If you don't believe me, do the research. Find me a Buddist group that believes God created everything. Sure. As it turns out, no religions besides literalist Christianity and fundamentalist Islam (probably, I haven't asked) take creationism seriously. Most religions are surprisingly accepting of the findings of science - except for literalist Christianity. To the contrary - I would assume that Christians, who claim to follow the teachings of Christ, would ack Christlike. Did Jesus call people "retards"? You're free to disagree, but then you would be in the position of asserting that Christians aren't supposed to act like Christ, which is simply bizarre. Hey, I'm not telling you. I'm just telling you what the Bible tells you. If you don't believe me, why don't you go ask your pastor if you should call people "retards"? Well, why don't you look at the major creationist organizations and tell me what religion they appear to be. After all, if the creationist position is that the Chrisitan Bible is literally true, don't you think that would put Buddist or even Jewish creationists in kind of a bind?

Okay Crash... lemme just toss one thing out quick.... I never even said anything about Buddists, so about not believing God created everything, I really don't even care.... That is irrelevant.Next, I will say, you're right, most english speaking creationist are christians... But that is still aside from the major point, which is that you brought religion, and in particular christianity, in to a place it wasn't being discussed, and is common for evolutionists to do. I know you'll say, well your assumtion that I was christian was to say how I shouldn't be using the language I was, whcih I'll address shortly, but other stuff first....On a different section of your latest post......Again, you're wrong in your ridiculous assumptions, but at least you say this time "(probably, I haven't asked)".... You mention literalist christianity and islam.... Have you ever heard of jews? Need I go on.... Almost all religions are based on a creator? And you are saying that most don't believe God created "everything".... Well, so what? While they may not believe he created "everything", it is acknowledged that he created something. You are basically saying that the creationist view is limited to those who believe only one specific way. Islamists, Jews, and Christians don't believe all of the same thing, but they're all based on creation.Even if I wasn't christian, it seems inconceivable to me that most evolutionists don't believe something was created by some higher power at some point..... I mean, who created Earth? The big bang.. oh.. well, who created the universe? oh, also the big bang... um, who created the vacume or whatever to cause the big bang? The point is, there are many levels of people who accept that something was created at some point.... But you call it a "movement" by cristians to believe what they believe... Just another example of the discrimination and attack religion has been under so much lately. Because people come here to a site devoted to discussing creation vs. evolution, they are called a "movement." It's the same as how leftwingers like to throw around the "close minded" phrase all the time, but they care contradicting themselves because they are closing there mind to someone else having their own views/beliefs.Now, back to that language issue... Where was the English language at the time the Bible was written? Oh that's right, it didn't exist... Thus words like sh**, fu**, etc..... Have no relevence to anything that "literalist christians (in your words)", should be concerned with. Yes, probably 99.99% of christians would disagree with me, and say swearing is wrong... But I believe they would be wrong. Again, the English language didn't exist... So saying "I'm going to take a sh**" is the sam as "I'm going to take a dump(crap)(dookie)(etc.)"... They are just words, and your point might matter if I answered to a church.... But TRUE "literalist christians", don't answer to a church, they answer to GOD HIMSELF. Sorry to burst your bubble about the swearing, but it's just ridiculous. Again I'll point out that I'm not governed by the church your mommy and daddy made you go to that you so despise now, so don't impose your view of what christianity is on me.You know what, you're right, though... The sentiments I used were not "Christlike." Don't tell me the bible teaches you to be Christ Like... the bible teaches that he is the only man to ever live without sin, and that is an un-achievable goal. Christians believe that he died for our sins, and sinning is an unavoidable thing for the rest of us. Tempers often get the better of us, and I certainly am no exception. While Christians are taught to strive to be "good christians" and follow the teachings of Jesus... Christians are also taught that we aren't even close to perfect, and never will be... Again, I never injected christianity into this anyway, so you shouldn't be comparing my actions to Jesus's anyway.And while you may be right about another thing... Most creationist organizations may be christian based, that is because Christians seem to seek proving evolution wrong with conventional methods, instead of "God did it"s. It's difference from most other religions which are bound by blind faith, and most christians are too, but these organizations you speak of don't come out and just quote the bible. They use scientific findings, etc. to argue a point of view. Again, I never even came here saying ANYTHING about God, Jesus, or Christianity.... Which is the same with how most of these organizations approach the issue too. They may show biblical references to verify coralations and such, but they don't come in here like an islamist and say "Ala is gonna have some virgins waitin' for me if I go explode myself in a crowd of jewish kids." Which is a blind faith thing. Whatever, this is all aside from the point.by the way... sorry about all the "edits", I re-read and kept finding mis-spellings that could have totally caused a sentence to read different ways....
[This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003][This message has been edited by rabair, 09-13-2003]

Not nessicarily special, magic creation. I have no problem with people who believe that God created the universe and humanity by setting up initial conditions such that humans evolved through a process consistent with the scientific evidence. That's not Creationism, though.So, no, the Jews aren't largely Creationists, just as the Catholics aren't. They believe in a Creator God, I suppose, but they're theistic evolutionists, largely. Not creationists. Again, no. Creationism isn't just Christians "believing what they believe." It's unique among religions in that it actually perverts science to vcreate false support for the tenants of it's holy book. The Jews don't do this. The Catholics don't. Why do Protestant Christians feel the need to?Believe it or not, it's possible to have both faith in God and a belief in evolution. I don't personally, but many evolutionists here are people of faith. You might go ask them how it's done before you assume that any religious faith whatsoever discounts your ability to be an evolutionist. As one of the leftwingers you're talking about, I assure you that liberals prize diversity of viewpoint - except for the viewpoint that there can be no diversity of viewpoint. This is not contradictory. It's impossible to be so welcoming of others that you welcome those who won't welcome others. I know that you do. So ask yourself, "does God want me calling people retards?" I'm surprised that you haven't asked yourself that already, in fact. I would assume that the Commandment against bearing false witness against people would preclude you from calling people who aren't retarded "retards". But, you know. Who cares about the commandments? They're only God's word. Romans 6:1-2

quote:

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What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?

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Sorry, dude. The Bible says that you don't get a pass on sinning just because you've been saved. Part of having faith and being saved is that you stop sinning. What did Jesus say to the adulteress? "Go and sin no more." How come you're still sinning so unrepentantly?I realize that you're not perfect. But it seems to me the thing to do here, if you admit that what you called WK was wrong, would be to apologize. Not to defend the sin. Well, jeez, here's a crazy idea - if you just got mad, and said something you regret, why not apologize? It's what adults do when they say things they didn't mean. Why not? You argue a position held only by persons of Christian faith - the need to challenge science that doesn't agree with the Bible. I assumed therefore that you were of that faith. Faith isn't just an idea, it's something you have to put into practice, therefore I pointed out an inconsistency between your faith and your practice.I defend my assumption, because it was clearly dead on. Were you not actually a Christian, your objection might have merit. Honestly I don't see what you're so ashamed about that you have to hide your faith on the internet. I seriously don't care if your Christian or not. But shouldn't you care?[This message has been edited by crashfrog, 09-13-2003]

I really don't have time to keep doing this with you because you couldn't be more wrong. You're whole post is contradicting it's self and agreeing with things I've said but passing them off as arguing with me. Number one, you're still painting a picture of what a creationist is, because of your angry definition of christians. A creationist is someone who believes in CREATION, on any level. Not just christians.... Stop going after them because you're so full of hate... Jews and Catholics and almost every other religion are creationists too, so no you're not right.... Not that they do except evolution, maybe Catholics mostly do because they are the lazy man's religion, and maybe some jews do.... But the point is, they still believe in a creator.... For you to say otherwise is ignorant. I swear you're 10 years old. You seem to think you're such an authority on what "christians do", just becasue you read a few websites, and again mommy and daddy's church pissed you off. You need to shut up about things you don't know about, and don't take scripture out of context.Again, about the retard thing, I don't answer to you... Or your definition of Christianity... I don't know how many times I have to say that to you. YOU ARE NOT GOD. And not that I owe you anything, but if you pulled your head out of your ass, you might see I already apologized for it a few posts ago, and Mark accepted, and Wicked hasn't been back.... So just shut your mouth, you're ignorant, you think everyone definition is the same as yours, and it's just mind boggling that you keep ignoring that. You avoid the fact that your definition of "creationists" as being only christian, isn't the same view as everyone. Creationists are people who believe in creation, period. Because you hate Christianity so much shows your true colors... Again, because it was you who brought religion, and christianity up at all... Your anger about Christianity, cancels out any conversation about it.By the way, you say "I know that you do", about saying true christians answer to god, not a certain church... But in your previous post you say I should "go ask my pastor." You're just a flip flopping to try to suit different arguments and it's ridiculous. I noticed you didn't mention your problem with swearing again?Then what is your last paragraph supposed to be about? Hiding faith on the internet? Ashamed? What are you talking about? Please, Please, Please pull your head out of your ass you child. I've said it over and over.... I haven't brought it up. That's not hiding it. Because those who bring it up before making any other points, I admit shouldn't be taken seriously. Someone who comes in quoting Genesis, is just going to get laughed at and ignored. I came in presenting questions completely unrelated to The Bible, or christianity on any level. You must be dizzy because you spin like a top...Actually, I just went back and read the paragraph above that... and You say something else stupid.... AGAIN! You say that I "argue a position held only by persons of Christian faith".... When did I ever argue a position? You ridiculous... Questioning someone elses position doesn't mean I was arguing a particular position. And again, it's not only Christians that believe in a creator (creation), your lying. I'll make it simple. You are a liar. Anyone who believes in any level of creation is a creationist... So just put that to bed, it is absolute bunk, and shows a lack of knowledge... Jews and Catholics not creationists? Are you insane!?
Yeah, I know you'll come back with, "theistic evolutionists", but number one, that may be the case with Catholics, but I highly doubt Jews, especially not Jews in Israel. Also, you can use words like "theistic" to deflect the truth but one who believes in "creation" is still a "creationist" no matter how you slice it. These people haven't adopted the evolutionist beliefs, they just have been taught it's fact and really don't care either way, or to find out for themselves. They would as easily tell you that God created man and everything else in 7 days when asked, but they would also tell you a contradicting statement, that they believe evolution. 99% People just don't really care.Another quick spinning quote from you "Believe it or not, it's possible to have both faith in God and a belief in evolution." Obviously I'm not one, but I just got through telling you that same thing in my last post. Don't use a statement to agree with me to look as if you're proving me wrong somehow. I've outlined above, I'm not going to go over again.I really don't have time for this, but I have to address your "stop sinning" comment. For a person to say that would show how stupid they truly are. You take an out of context passage, which you clearly didn't read the rest of, or have no comprehension of.... And anything like that can be said. In the old testament everyone had slaves, and servants and concubines.... The point is, as I said in my last post... JESUS DIED FOR OUR SINS. That's why he came, because we are born sinners. If you take that passage as a whole, you'll get what it says, and if you take The Bible as a whole, you'll understand that we're all born sinners and it isn't possible to not be or to stop sinning. So your statement is ridiculous on that level. And on the level that I don't answer to you. And that you think I should apologize when, again I don't answer to you, but I already apologized. Grow up and respond when you have ANY concept of ANYTHING. Quit just coming on here showing your ass because you're angry at the Christian chursh.

Hi, Rabair!I'm pretty sure your last two replies have been to Crashfrog, but it's hard to tell because you don't quote anything, and you didn't use the reply button. At the bottom of each message is a little reply button with a little red arrow. If you click on the reply buttom at the bottom of the message you're replying to then the system automatically keeps track of who you're replying to, sends notification that they've received a reply if they've requested it, and adds links to and from reply and message to help people follow the discussion. In the Creation/Evolution debate, a Creationist is *not* someone who believes in a Creator. I, for one, believe in a Creator, and I am definitely not a Creationist.In general, a Creationist is someone who believes that life on earth did not arise through naturalistic causes. There are many other relevant issues, but I think that is the main one. The vast majority of Creationists are evangelical Christians who accept a literal interpretation of Genesis and believe the world and universe were created about 6,000 years ago, that original sin derives from the actions of Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden, and that modern geology is a result of the great flood. You don't quote what Crash said to get you so upset, so I can't tell if your response is justified or not, but you might consider the advantages of a more measured response, including being able to keep your posting privileges.By the way, quoting is easy. There's a link next to the message box that you type into called *UBB Code is ON, and if you click on it it will describe how to do quoting and use the UBB codes in general. Wow!Just so I don't catch you off guard, I'm also Admin. I'm checking into this thread for the first time since it opened. You're probably already skirting a bit too close to the Forum Guidelines, so you might want to tone it down a notch. If you quote what you're replying to in the future I'll more easily be able to tell if your responses are justified, but keep in mind that replying in kind isn't encouraged here. In other words, violating the forum guidelines because someone else did it first will probably just get both your posting privileges suspended.--Percy

I'm sorry, you're just wrong about this. Why don't you ask theistic evolutionists like Percipient here, who runs the board, if he thinks of himself as a creationist?People who believe that God made life through a process of natural evolution simply aren't creationists. They don't think of themselves as creationists, and creationist organizations like Answers In Genesis don't think of them as creationists. So if nobody thinks of them as creationists but you, who are you to tell both the people in question and creationist organizations like Answers In Genesis that they're wrong? Right, but that's not what it means to be a creationist. Creationism is the position that life on earth (or human beings at least) were specifically and specially created by God some 6000 years ago. Anything less than that is evolutionism. Now, there's varieties of creationism, to be sure, but none of them say that humans evolved naturally from other life in the way suggested by the fossil record, absent of divine intervention. That's the evolutionary position, and it's sufficiently broad to include people who believe in God, like Percipient, and persons like myself, who do not. Good thing I'm not angry about it. We can talk about it. Nope. Again, I know what Chrisitans are supposed to be like, because I was one. And when I was one, if you had been acting the way you are around me, I would have been ashamed that you called yourself Christian, as you should be ashamed now. Ah, yes. When Scripture is telling you not to do something you want to do, it's just being taken "out of context". Again we see the escape hatch of the Biblical Literalist. Pray tell, explain to me the context that allows Romans 6:1-2 to allow you to sin whenever you like without contrition. I never had a problem with your swearing, despite your rather flimsy justification for it. Again, I challenge you to run your interpretations of the Bible past your pastor, not because you answer to him, but because he has more experience reading the Bible than you do. It's the same view of creationists. Shouldn't I take their word for it? You need to tell that to Answers In Genesis, and the ICR, and other leading creationist organizations, because they have a differing definition than you. And as they are in the business of knowing who the creationists are and aren't, I'm more inclined to take their word over yours. Um, when you argued. That's what an argument is - persons taking opposing positions to defend them. It's ludricous to suggest you've argued without taking a position. Like I said, explain to me the context that makes Romans 6:1-2 say that you can sin whenever you like without contrition.

Fine, I don't really care what you call a creationist or anything like that. You've avoided the point all along. You brought Christianity in and tried to tell me how a Christian should act, which is stupid, and doesn't belong here. As I said, Cristian Creationists don't come here and try to use the Bible as a history book, they use real evidence and science, etc. So you are wrong to bring Christianity in here and throw it around with such authority. You keep avoiding the one thing I'm showing you... You repremand me repeatedly for something I did. I DO NOT ANSWER TO YOU!!! And just because you were a Christian, doesn't mean you know what they "are supposed to be like". Catholics are Christians, supposedly, but they aren't anything like all the other denominations... Your view of Christianity is irrelavent, and again has no place in the Human Origins board. By the way, when I swore originally, i censored it myself, and only even used the words to express my tone at the time. It wasn't like I just got out of control and spouted off swears. I used them with little "**"s so you would understand the tone of something. And you keep talking about "contrition." I already apologized to those guys, BEFORE YOU EVEN BROUGHT IT UP! I don't know what you want... NOR DO I CARE. You are nobody, and I don't owe any type of repentence to you for something that you had nothing to do with. Because I repent to God for things doesn't mean I get on a message board and type it out! I talk to God... I guess I don't belong the any denomination like you where if you are remorsefull for any type of sin, that you must go on an internet message board and confess your sin to evolutionist. Thanks, now it's clear to me what I should do... I've seen the light... After apologizing for calling someone a name, I should come on an internet message board, and confess that to someone who isn't even involved, and that is the true Christian way. Thanks for showing me the path Crash...And I have to go back to swearing again. You call my argument flimsy, and you say that you know I don't answer to a pastor.... But you go on to say that because he has more experience reading the bible that I should run my view by him. That would be answering to the pastor. I don't belong to any denomination, and "literallist Christians", know that personal walk with Jesus, doesn't have to involve a pastor giving you shove. And again I say, the "sh" word is the same as "crap" "poop" "dump" whatever, it is English and didn't exsist at the time The Bible was written, so your argument that it isn't Christian like is stupid. I already said I know 99.99% Christians would disagree, but that is just society and blind faith leading them. They never bothered to question, "why is swearing bad?", and they don't care, and I don't think they should. But I happen to see an obvious truth. These words didn't exist, and the only thing that made them bad was society saying they were.I really don't have time to keep arguing with you Crash, so if you could just stop saying stupid things it'd be a lot easier....

Hey Percy.... I'm not trying to demand or anything, but if you go back and read through the posts over the last 4 or 5 days, you'll see whats going on here... I don't know if you have time, but whatever.... I'll give you and Crash what your view of a Creationist is, I really don't even care, and it's irrelevant if you go back and see how this started. And by the way, I just got in the habbit of not using the "reply" button on the message because I used to have like 2 or 3 people jumpin' on board for evolutionists, and I don't have time to sit and do individual posts for each of them... As for the quote thing, I didn't know about the UBB thing, but I also usually quote with quotation marks if you read through my posts.Now, about skirting to close to the guidelines, well, I really don't have time to read them so if you want to kick me out that's fine... But the annoying thing is Crash brought up religion out of clear anger at Christianity in a place where it didn't belong. I pointed that out, and he thinks he's Jesus or something because he won't stop trying to tell me what is Christian and what isn't, and I can't just let this kid feel like he's some kind of genius if I just ignore him... But I'm going to have to because he is just off the wall stupid. Whatever, I just think the post should have been done many posts ago if it's going to end for being off topic as I've seen others. Ever since Mark and I stopped really discussing our issue, it's been about Crash preaching his version of Christianity which he doesn't believe. Which isn't relevant to Human Origins. If he was arguing something about Genesis or something it might make sense, but he's just saying what is Christian-like and it's ridiculous. Whatever, I don't have time for this, but it's difficult to ignore his ridiculousness.

Hi Crash!On the Internet I think kids often assume they're talking with other kids. Maybe you could view this philosophically a la the quote often misattributed to Mark Twain: In other words, this kid is at an age where he can't be told anything, which reminds me of another Twain quote, this one genuine, I think: If true then Rabair should go far! --Percy