What Is The Positive Evidence For Atheism?

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All Atheists are evolutionists, not a matter of opinion.

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What else could they be?

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Raelians.

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This whole idea of not knowing really bothers me.

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I think that many people feel that they have to be believers simply because they feel uncomfortable not knowing.

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That's what I've been saying for years and years, you know.I know this is going to sound patronizing, but in my opinion it is a matter of maturity to accept that the universe doesn't owe us any answers.I would much rather let mysteries be mysteries rather than believe something out of fear or comfort.The truth is more important than my feelings. Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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Right now, I'm peeling my Yukon Golds while the garlic roasts. Then, I'll bake a pumpkin pie with my secret family recipe; next, sautee celery and onion for the stuffing. After all that, I'll enjoy an anticipatory nap before proceeding.

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Work, work, work: an epicure's job is never done.

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I've got the cranberry tangerine relish, the sausage and onion stuffing, and the pumpkin cheesecake done. (the stuffing needs to bake yet)The bird just went into the oven, the neck and giblets are simmering with carrots, an onion, and parley stems on the stovetop for the gravy later.The walnuts are toasted for the Belgian endive, apple, and blue cheese salad with sherry vinegar and walnut oil dressing.Got to let that blue cheese come up to room temperature, peel the russets for mashed potatoes, and trim the asparagus.I've paced myself pretty well, I think.

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This is a very nice way of putting it.

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Thanks!

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Mmmmmm

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Sounds more like positive evidence for heaven on earth than positive evidence for atheism. Mouth watering!

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It was goooood.I'm having a repeat of everything but the endive salad in just a few minutes.

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So why is atheism illogical? All they do is assert no evidence.

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That's why I'm an agnostic.

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I fill it with God and you fill it with the natural and say that someday science may figure it all out.

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No, I (we?) fill it with "we don't know."How can you tell the difference between natural phenomena that we haven't figured out yet, or may never figure out, and supernaturally caused phenomena?

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I have no problem with that but when you say you don't know then presumably you are leaving open the possiblity of the supernatural.

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Sure, anythings possible. However, the supernatural as the cause of anything has had a terrible track record over the millenia.What's possible isn't important. What's probable is.I mean, it is possible that any of the thousands of religious myths about the origins of anything are true. So what?

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As I said genetics may explain how we experience emotion but I don't see it explaining why emotions exist.

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Just becasue you can't think of a natural explanation for why emotions exist doesn't mean nobody has.Seriously, though, you really, truly can't think of any possible reproductive advantage to, say, jealousy, or love, or anger, or kindness?I can.Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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The point is that we have a personal testimony of divine revelation. The evidence that it is true is that he completely devoted his life to Christian service and that as a result of what was largely his work the Christian church became established amongst the gentiles.

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David Koresh did something similar with his life, you know.As did the Buddah, Sun Myung Moon, and Joseph Smith.Did all of these people have real divine experiences? How can we tell?

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We have been given wisdom and reason. I believe that God intended us to use it. I think that you have to look at their legacy. I think we have to consider what they say as compared to what we observe.

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When you look at the teachings of the Buddah I tend to think that he was given divine revelation. As for Moon he may well have had divine revelation initially but I would suggest that he got off track as he went along. I have my doubts about Joseph Smith.

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So, we are to assume that you are correct in your judgements?Why should we do that?(You do realize that the Buddha founded a religion that does not ascribe to the idea of there being a God, don't you?)Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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I just see this as a discussion about how we view life and the reasons for it. Actually, the fact that we have a curiosity about these things at all is an indication that there is a god.

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Why on earth would curiosity about our social behavior indicate anything at all about the existence of any supernatural anything?We evolved to be social animals with really freakishly large, powerful brains. We can think really complicated, abstract thoughts.The reason we have curiosity about such things is because we are smart enough to have such a thought and also the ability to articulate it to others.It is an enormous, completely uneeded leap to conclude the existence of your view of the Christian God from humanities cognitive abilities.

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But he also taught that we are to love our enemies, care for the poor etc. That is what I believe was revealed to him.

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Er, revealed?What, do you think it takes divine intervention for someone to figure that stuff out?

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GDR is asking why do we have such conceptions about God with more prevalence than other abstract ideas?

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I am not at all convinced that this is the case.

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He's saying, if people are generally fixated on God, even people that claim not to believe in God, isn't that evidence that something of that order exists?

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People who don't claim to believe in God aren't really "fixated" on God. What we fixate upon here at EvC is the poor logic and faulty reasoning used by most believers to try to prove God's existence.Such as GDR's idea.

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Why does the notion of God illicit such strong, negative emotions in many atheists, but warm, comfortable notions in the believer?

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I can't understand why you think that unbelievers have strong negative emotions about something they don't believe in.I never think about superstitions in my day to day life. The only time I talk about God is here, and that's just because I like the debate and analysis.

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That doesn't explain why God is a common theme among humans, whether pro or con.

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You left out the part of my post that gave an explanation: Why wouldn't really smart, problem-solving social animals, who grow up and live their whole lives in tight clan-like family units, who also are frightened and confused by all of the powerful natural phenomena that threaten them every day, wonder if there was an unseen creature pulling all the stings behind the scenes? I mean, we wonder that about other people, because we know they can do things without our knowledge, so it seems logical to a human ignorant of the natural causes of things to think that there must also be a magical person making the sun fly across the sky, or throwing the lightning bolts, or witholding the rains, or breathing life into creatures.

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I think it is a completely unneeded leap to conclude that based on our cognitive abilities, that it should explain why the concept of God not only exists en masse, but prevailed through the millennia.

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Uh, Juggs? You are familiar with the idea of cultural indoctrination and sociental control, aren't you? Edited by nator, : No reason given.

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but in the case of the early Jews it represented a very different world view than that established by their more powerful and sophisticated pagan neighbours.

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OK, but so?Why does it require divine intervention for someone to have an idea that maybe we should be kind to each other?

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What do we endlessly talk about more than anything else?

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Religion's interference in science education?Creationist's dishonesty and ignorance?Sex, particularly homosexuality and reproductive rights?

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Where have I ever said that my view represented any proof of God's existence.

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Every time you say something like, "Just the fact that we have curiosity about X seems to indicate that God exists.", or "It just makes more sense, if X is a certain way, that God exists.", it certainly appears as though you are attempting to argume that your view represents an attempt to provide evidence for God's existence.How else are we meant to take such a statement, other than that you are stating your reasons, which you think are good and sound arguments, for thinking God exists?It is a bit precious for you to make such statements repeatedly, but then say that you aren't trying to present "a case".

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I did not say that it requires it, I just believe that it makes more sense than anything else.

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Why does it make more sense than anything else?Which is more sensical?:1) That many people have observed suffering and wish to alleviate it in their fellow humans, simply because we are capable of empathy, which is a product of our brains and evolved just like all other brain functions, or2) Your particular conception of god exists, and magicked into those people the thought that we should be kind to each other.Seriously, which one passes the rationality test?