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Author | Topic: Marxism | |||||||||||||||||||||||
DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
I do believe you don't fully understand the words you are using.
socialism generally refers to an economic system, while communism generally refers to both an economic and a political system. Communism, seeks to manage both the economy and the society by ensuring that property is owned collectively, and that control over the distribution of property is centralized in order to achieve both classlessness and statelessness. To keep everyone equal in a society. Socialism seeks to manage economy through social control. Socialists, see capitalism as a possible part of the state and believe that socialism can exist in a capitalist society. One of the ideas of socialism is that everyone within the society will benefit from capitalism as much as possible as long as the capitalism is controlled somehow by a centralized planning system to keep it within a state in which it doesn't do serious damage to any members of the society. Please don't let the "Conservative" brainwashing of the 1980's persist in modern times. Calling someone a socialist and a communist is very ignorant and lacks understanding. To top it off many people throw the word Nazi in with these two even though the Nazi Party was founded to fight the "evil" communists.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
You missed the point of me defining and telling you the difference between communism and Socialism.
Taxes to fund government programs and regulating business in order to keep them from abusing and doing harm to other members of society IS NOT Marxist or communist it is socialist. Please learn the difference. These words have specific meanings. If you don't understand what they are then how are we to understand what you're trying to say? Communism is not socialism. Calling a socialist a communist is like calling a libertarian a Nazi. That's how big the difference is. (yes Nazi party ideas are to the "right" not the "left" but are a huge leap from libertarian)
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
You know why this ideal has never been reached? Because it's so far removed from human reality that it can't be reached. That's the problem with Marx, he lived in his head in some kind of economic neverneverland, and that's why his theories spawned such evil in the world and will continue to wherever people try to implement his ideas. That's the fate of all utopian fantasies. They ARE fantasies. Marx had foolish notions about human nature based on pure theory, pure fantasy, and that can only create monsters. Change the name Marx to Reagan or any other "conservative" that thinks a 100% free capitalist market can work and we may have something here. Both sound great in theory neither can work
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
You missed the point of me defining and telling you the difference between communism and Socialism.
Taxes to fund government programs and regulating business in order to keep them from abusing and doing harm to other members of society IS NOT Marxist or communist it is socialist. Please learn the difference. These words have specific meanings. If you don't understand what they are then how are we to understand what you're trying to say? Communism is not socialism. Calling a socialist a communist is like calling a libertarian a Nazi. That's how big the difference is. (yes Nazi party ideas are to the "right" not the "left" but are a huge leap from libertarian)
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
Here for you to read THIS TIME is what I wrote in message 27
quote: No they aren't. Those practices are standard in any civilized society that ever existed --- abe: OK, exaggeration -- they are COMPATIBLE with all civilized government. They are not socialism. Why do you distant socialist policies from socialism? Do you think Socialism is bad even though socialist governments have been proven to work?
I really think you are insisting on too stringent a distinction and, like I said, it must have started somewhere back in academia, probably to make socialism palatable by erasing any connection with Marxism, right? They are two very different words with different meanings.... so no.Calling a socialist a communist is like calling a libertarian a Nazi. Actually the case can be made and I've seen it made though I don't claim the ability to make it myself for you here, that Nazism and all forms of Fascism have more in common with the Left than the Right. Something about having to control and dictate to people instead of allowing them freedom to live as they please. Except they would be wrong Nazism was founded as an extreme effort to fight communism. It is an extreme "right" wing idea. You continue to show your ignorance by throwing dictatorships into the mix. So you're saying that anything that oppresses people is to the left? Wow... Do you understand economics beyond Glen Beck's Chalk board? Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
no fascism is almost the opposite of Communism .... I would suggest NOT getting your definitions off of Glen Beck's retarded Chalk Board
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
Government has the job of restraining criminal activity and providing services that are shared by all, not taking care of us. What is the difference? How is saving you from a fire or keeping a rapist or a murderer off the street not taking care of you? How is it different from helping you recover from a disease?
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
In THEORY communism is not fascism. In REALITY that is what it tends to become. except they are defined at two different parts of the political spectrum communism is damn near opposite of fascism.... Just because both have lead to wide spread oppression doesn't mean they are the same thing. You need to understand that you cannot lump Nazis , Socialists and Communists as the same thing because every one of these words has a completely different meaning. If you go far enough to the left you're communist if you go far enough to the right you're a fascist. There is no theory about it. YOU'RE WRONG Edited by DC85, : No reason given. Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
TAKING CARE OF means supplying basic means of existence. Good grief man. Restraining crime is what government IS supposed to do.
Who said this is it's job? I thought the idea of the government was to govern Here are some other words that are considered synonyms for govern manageadministrate direct oversee Well... It seems the government is here to manage the country and make sure the country running smoothly. Wouldn't you say a business that has become powerful and abusive to the point where it is causing harm to general population should be regulated? Wouldn't you say looking out for the health and well being of a country as a whole would help the country and make it stronger? I say it would be poor management not to do these things
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
Marx is a genius at abstract theory and an idiot when it comes to reality. Ronald Reagan was genius at abstract theory and an idiot when it comes to reality oh wait... yes that's what I intended to say....
The bigger the government grows the less it has anything to do with the people. It's of and by and for the people in theory only these days. Millions have joined the Tea Party movement but they have been ignored and misrepresented and smeared. Only SOME of "the people" count, those that agree with this administration. Yet Obama has proven to be more conservative then Bush as far as expanding Government. Yet I heard nothing about massive Tea parties back then... except for the person who started them Mr. Ron Paul who has now been plowed down by the the idiots who hijacked the "movement"
Yes. The right has the voice of the radio but not the voice of the mainstream media who either ignore us or slant their stories against us. Who has the mainstream media? It ISN'T the left because the corporations pay for and own the mainstream media..... I thought the left wanted to destroy business... hmmmm I think you need to rethink this without listening to the druggie on the radio
hey are in business to make money. What other incentive could there possibly be for having the headaches of running a business? of course they are but if they become to powerful to the point of doing harm to general population shouldn't they be regulated? Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
Marxist influences in this country, and whether they are "pure" or not is irrelevant to me. Most here are probably a generation younger than I am, at least, and you've grown up UNDER that influence and don't have my perspective on it. considering most what was said at the time was fabricated and propaganda and still is concerning Communism. I now more then ever am sure you don't know what you're talking about. You've proven this because you honestly think fascism , Socialism and Communism are the same thing.
About media influence I see anti-rightist bias in almost every story I read these days. I need examples. Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
That incentive is interest. It makes loaning the money worth while, otherwise what is the point? You as the consumer have the choice to get a loan elsewhere because their APR is too high and tantamount to extortion. I agree to an extent. However the competition you describe no longer exists. you need the banks the banks don't need you. They're aware of this and charge outrageous interest and fees. To say don't go there or don't shop there in the current state is really an ignorant thing to say.
They have the choice to buy it or not to buy it. If no one buys it, it forces the seller to bring down prices because they otherwise aren't making a return investment. You have to spend money in order to make money. He controls the market and has a product everyone needs so he charges outrageous prices and people have little choice but to pay it. I don't know what country you're living in but this what the United States is now.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
As for equation between all the isms, as I said communism in theory is a very different thing from what it is in practice. You think only about the theory. In practice it tends to become fascism. No... I wasn't the one who said in theory. I think Communism leads to oppression. I simply pointed out that you don't have a clue what you're talking about because USSR style communism is still not fascism. You also still have the Bizarre idea that Socialism and communism are the same thing.
You figure I got that anti-Communist propaganda from the Communist radicals themselves? Odd. considering you don't have a clue what you're talking about I must assume they weren't Edited by DC85, : No reason given. Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
I wish I could without spending too much time at it. I also wish that you'd just take my word for it that this is how it reads to me. I KNOW you don't read the same stories the same way I do. Even if I showed you what I mean you wouldn't accept it. I see the bias, you wouldn't. I'd supply the information and we'd be arguing nastily for hours about whether it's really anti-right wing or not. It doesn't matter. I SEE the bias, you wouldn't because you share it as does most everybody else here. Do you see the anti-right wing bias HERE at least, because it's so thick it would take a sledgehammer to dent it. Could you be seeing what you want to see? Maybe what you're told you see? Like recently right wingers have been complaining about the coverage of the tea parties... I've seen these people in action a large percentage of them don't have a clue what they're protesting and going off on hate rants. While I disagree with Ron Paul on most issues this "movement" is not the tea party that he started and has been hijacked by idiots. It's now dangerous. I've witnessed these people first hand!
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DC85 Member Posts: 876 From: Richmond, Virginia USA Joined: |
You've done the same to me. I've pointed out the differences between Socialism and communism and you still say they're the same thing and claim fascism is part of communism...
the only justification for this idea you have is that you had or have communists friends. Let's try this. Please Define each word as you see it Socialism: Marxism: Communism: fascism: Edited by DC85, : No reason given.
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