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Author Topic:   We ain't made of what we thought
NoNukes
Member
Posts: 10115
From: Central NC USA
Joined: 08-13-2010
Member Rating: 1.8


(1)
Message 16 of 23 (816541)
08-06-2017 1:37 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
08-05-2017 11:45 PM


Re: Mind Over Matter
A home, for example, is not bricks and mortar. It is the lives and shared experiences of the life within.

So you are so in tune with humanity, and beyond the cares of ordinary mortals, that you don't really find important the house part of a home. You don't really value the shelter from the wind and rain, nor the safety and security of the strong structure. It's all about family and shared experiences for you.

I don't believe even you buy that load.


Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)

I was thinking as long as I have my hands up … they’re not going to shoot me. This is what I’m thinking — they’re not going to shoot me. Wow, was I wrong. -- Charles Kinsey

I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as cause for withdrawing from a friend. Thomas Jefferson

Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith

I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 08-05-2017 11:45 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Phat, posted 08-06-2017 2:08 AM NoNukes has acknowledged this reply

    
Phat
Member
Posts: 10222
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 17 of 23 (816545)
08-06-2017 2:08 AM
Reply to: Message 16 by NoNukes
08-06-2017 1:37 AM


Re: Mind Over Matter
So you are so in tune with humanity, and beyond the cares of ordinary mortals, that you don't really find important the house part of a home.
No, I'm just saying that you guys are making a huge deal out of atoms from other galaxies as if the universe itself is one pantheistic organ. I, as a staunch monotheist, am emphasizing what it is that really makes us human...no matter where the bricks in our house came from.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
"as long as chance rules, God is an anachronism."~Arthur Koestler

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 Message 16 by NoNukes, posted 08-06-2017 1:37 AM NoNukes has acknowledged this reply

Replies to this message:
 Message 23 by Taq, posted 08-09-2017 11:02 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 5233
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 2.1


(1)
Message 18 of 23 (816552)
08-06-2017 3:39 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
08-05-2017 11:45 PM


Re: Mind Over Matter
Phat writes:

Big deal. All we are talking about is matter.

Yes, all we're talking about is what we and everything around us is made of. Probably not a big deal at all!

I prefer thinking of humans in regards to life and soul.

They're not alternatives Phat, you are allowed to think about both.


I cant figure out why it matters where the atoms came from.

It's because we - well many people, maybe not you and others who pefer mythology for their explanations - like to know how our world works and where we came from.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 08-05-2017 11:45 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
New Cat's Eye
Member
Posts: 11839
From: near St. Louis
Joined: 01-27-2005
Member Rating: 1.6


Message 19 of 23 (816579)
08-06-2017 3:55 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
08-05-2017 11:45 PM


Re: Mind Over Matter
Big deal. All we are talking about is matter. I prefer thinking of humans in regards to life and soul. Always remember that mind is over matter. A home, for example, is not bricks and mortar. It is the lives and shared experiences of the life within.

But you do need the bricks and mortar too... Just like the mind needs the matter.

I cant figure out why it matters where the atoms came from.

File it under: "That's neat"


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 08-05-2017 11:45 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 13963
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 1.7


(1)
Message 20 of 23 (816627)
08-08-2017 12:26 PM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
08-05-2017 11:45 PM


Re: Mind Over Matter
Phat writes:

A home, for example, is not bricks and mortar.


I'd be the first to agree that a house is not a home. I want to shriek when realtors say they don't sell houses, they sell homes. I personally define a house as everything outside the paint and a home as everything inside the paint. You can move your home to a different house. You can't buy a ready-made home.

But try to tell a homeless person that bricks and mortar don't matter. Homeless is also houseless. If they had a house they could make a home inside it - but it's hard to have a home without a house.

Phat writes:

I prefer thinking of humans in regards to life and soul.


We talk about keeping body and soul together. What's a soul without a body to house it?
This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 08-05-2017 11:45 PM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
Son Goku
Member
Posts: 1082
From: Ireland
Joined: 07-16-2005
Member Rating: 7.0


Message 21 of 23 (816664)
08-09-2017 8:21 AM
Reply to: Message 15 by Phat
08-05-2017 11:45 PM


Re: Mind Over Matter
People just find it interesting, because people have different interests. For those of us who find such things interesting, it matters because it reveals a new layer in the history of the world.

It's like me going to a knitting talk and announcing that my philosophically enlightened mind thinks of clothes in terms of their social function. So what? They're there for the talk, because they find it interesting.

I'm surprised this would need to be explained.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 15 by Phat, posted 08-05-2017 11:45 PM Phat has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by Phat, posted 08-09-2017 9:49 AM Son Goku has not yet responded

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 10222
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.3


Message 22 of 23 (816669)
08-09-2017 9:49 AM
Reply to: Message 21 by Son Goku
08-09-2017 8:21 AM


Re: Mind Over Matter
I just like to hear peoples reasoning is all. You broke it down quite simply, as did nearly everyone else. It is easier to understand the reasoning as a whole when others contribute their explanations and philosophies.

For those of us who find such things interesting, it matters because it reveals a new layer in the history of the world.
When we deal with physical reality we find layers of matter. When we deal with philosophical reality, our very conversations often add layers to a concept. I'm simply questioning the value of the added layer regarding atoms at a distance forming matter at our celestial home. We not only represent our home with our bodies but with our minds and ideas as well. I was merely saying that my layer is spiritual...and the other members quickly forced me to accept the physical layer intertwined with the spiritual or mental layer that I was presenting.

Edited by Phat, : No reason given.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
"as long as chance rules, God is an anachronism."~Arthur Koestler

This message is a reply to:
 Message 21 by Son Goku, posted 08-09-2017 8:21 AM Son Goku has not yet responded

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 7271
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.9


(2)
Message 23 of 23 (816681)
08-09-2017 11:02 AM
Reply to: Message 17 by Phat
08-06-2017 2:08 AM


Re: Mind Over Matter
Phat writes:

I, as a staunch monotheist, am emphasizing what it is that really makes us human...no matter where the bricks in our house came from.

I would say that part of what makes us human is curiosity, a sense of adventure, and the seeking of knowledge. We are now answering questions that we thought we could never answer just 1,000 years ago. We have learned more about the universe in the last 50 years than the entire history of mankind before that. I would consider that to be one of the greatest human achievements.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 17 by Phat, posted 08-06-2017 2:08 AM Phat has acknowledged this reply

  
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