Human Programming

So if I go a little bit further in your train of though, we are all programmed to seek the truth with little or no influence from our environment ? I don't think I said I found any hate in my church, since I've never been part of any church to begin with. Although I do think that there is much hatred in a lot of religions.

Human programming.If I said that the bible isn't a verifiable source of information (Like most scientist tend to conclude) can someone who strongly believe in the bible can tell me why do they say otherwise?Keep in mind that nobody refutes scientist when it comes to:
-our solar system
-gravity
-the law of physics
-etc..I want to know what make you decide that scientific around the world are wrong on this specific subject?And try to see the larger picture, in term of numbers, we mean nothing alone, there is millions of people adhering to a different religions then yours. And they believe as strongly as you that their religion is the truth.My answer to this is human programming.

My belief is that studying the environment is one of the ways to find truth. Your point seemed to be that faith is a result of how we are socialized. I'm prepared to agree with that to a point.I'm suggesting though that all mankind has a desire to know about ourselves and our environment. Why do we as humans bother with physics, philosophy, theology, genealogy etc?If it weren’t for this search for truth then your point wouldn't exist. Of course my kids were influenced by what I believe to be the truth of the Christian religion, but eventually they had to come to their own conclusions just as I did. Atheists and secularists influence their kids in just the same way. Sorry, I had thought you had. Hatred is in a lot of people whether they are religious or not, but there is also a lot of love. That is one of the choices that we were given, (metaphorically), in the Garden of Eden.

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Everybody is entitled to my opinion.

I was (almost literally) born in church. I spent the first fifteen years of my life going to church three times on Sunday and two more times during the week. After that, it tapered off drastically, but I think you could say that I had ample oppurtunity to be programmed.The thing is, though, I don't think I ever really "believed". I could go through the motions. I could quote scripture before I could read it (and I can still remember a little of it ). But it never really rang true. I don't know if I was born a skeptic or if those experiences made me the skeptic that I am.So, I didn't move "to" another religion, but I certainly moved "away" from the one I grew up in. And I'm still in the same culture - I live two blocks from the house I grew up in - unless you consider the ultra-religious sub-culture a culture.If I had been born in Saudi Arabia, would I still be the same skeptic? It would certainly be harder to express that skepticism there, but would it change who I am?Hope that helps confuse the issue.

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I believe that who you are is mainly the product of your environment (friends family, school etc..)Of course, we are all born with specific characteristics that makes us different to start with. But it can be tempered with.Most of us believe that in a civilized society, stoning someone is wrong. Although if you were born in a different time, it would be probably easier to accept.

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and I think that if we are to be honest, we must acknowledge that God could let us know she exists.

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But which is more probable:that God really does exists, is understandable, and makes herself known to you,orthat you are wrong and your belief in God is something you've manufactured inside your own mind and is also a product of culture?

What!?How can you bring probability into the existance of god? let alone if he is understandable..... Nope, not me. Of course its a product of culture.

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How can you bring probability into the existance of god? let alone if he is understandable.....

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Very easily.I mean, we are talking about a comparison here.It is far more likely that you have invented your belief, since we have extremely ample evidence that people do, in fact, easily and frequently invent their own beliefs.We don't, on the other hand, have any evidence whatsoever for God.

Then we disagree on what evidence is... Aren't everyone's beliefs invented by themselves if they differ in any way from another belief?What is your point?That God doesn't exist? That's not a very hard conclusion to come to.

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ABE: Which is more probable, "X" or 50%?If you don't know the probability of X then how can you compare?Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.

The problem which arises is that you must have invented this belief also.Was it a product of your programming, or not?If we have no evidence of God, how do we know if a belief is invented? Edited by anastasia, : No reason given.

Aren't everyone's beliefs invented by themselves if they differ in any way from another belief? I think programming can have a huge effect, some beliefs are hard to determine if they were a product of programming or not, some are pretty obvious. What do you think? I think schraf is looking at the beliefs deemed obviously products of programming and then saying that if you have that same belief then, most likely, it is a product of your programming.

Thats exactly what happens dude: Distorted Thinking is a term used in cognitive behavioural psychology to indicate the type of thoughts one can have that are not a true reflection of reality.People who suffer from Depression have a particular family of distorted thoughts that primarily revolve around negative assessment of self, future and world.Typically our negative life experience promote this 'negative schema' for interpretating meaning form the world.Ditto for religious people. They interpret the world through a lens of distortion, a distortion that leads to various confirmation biases for their a priori conclusions.Exactly the same in any one who is depressed, anxious, health anxious, ocd, panic disorder, bdm, this list goes on.....We are preprogramed to draw conclusions and if our initial training in critical analysis (as we explore the world as children) is distorted (in this case religious up bringing) it takes conciderable effort or natural apptitude (in critical thinking) to overcome that handicap.

The evidence strongly points to there being no god to have belief in.Even if there was only a tiny amount of evidence that there are no gods, it would trump no eveidence in gods simply because of its existance.

Evidence is something that is evident to the majority of people.I can't really get how can someone firmly believe in god because of the bible (Qu'ran, Tora etc).Is the Tora an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the Qu'ran an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the Bible an evidence of God ? of course not
Is the book of mormont an evidence for God ? of course not
Is the book of scientology an evidence for an alien life ? of course not
Is our ignorance an evidence of a creator ? of course notSo if we exclude theses books, what do you base your belief on ?Edited by Kader, : No reason given.

Sure, they differ from other invented beliefs. At one point or another every belief can be traced back to an 'inventor'. Well, I agree that people tend to identify with the belief system they grew up in. It does not mean they believe in it. There is a greater tendency to act in a manner that shows one does not believe, then there is to willfully seek out another belief.For example, many nominal Catholics regard divorce as a personal choice. The church plainly forbids it. While some divorcees will seek out a religon which allows this view, most will continue to call themselves Catholic because their parents were. I do not see the situation working the opposite way, where someone who was atheist and believes in divorce would choose to follow a religion that does not believe in it. Is one person more honest with themselves? Hm. Can you give me an example of a belief that is obviously a part of programming? I am thinking that what you are saying does not make sense if it is phrased like this.First I need to know how to tell if a belief is obviously programmed. But assuming you mean, instilled by surroundings or upbringing, then I will rephrase you.If my neighbor is a born and raised devout Muslim, and obviously programmed, and I have that same belief i.e., I am Muslim, then I am probably programmed?