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Author Topic:   Alas, poor Ohio .... EvC related news
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 141 of 179 (117498)
06-22-2004 11:39 AM
Reply to: Message 140 by contracycle
06-22-2004 6:32 AM


Re: Evolving Views
DS writes:
Are you suggesting that you see no patterns in nature? Are you suggesting that you see absolutely no evidence of design in the universe? No designs anywhere that are intelligent in their construct?
contracycle:I can safely say, none whatsoever. I find the idea that the universe is a "designed" phenomoenon quite perplexing - what is it that makes you think it IS designed, and why? Why would anyone think that?
I think the more important question here is why would you so close your mind to other possibilities that you would not consider it a probability, however remote? We are not talking about design theory here, only about design and the appearance of design.
DS writes:
Are the orbits of the planets in our solar system an example of a working design or do they make abrupt and random changes, resulting in the deterioration and instability of life on our planet?
contracycle:Thats nuts; why wouldn't they? Design is not required for orbits to be stable.
So then, is it your understanding that the distance between the planets, their moon(s), and the sun is irrelevant to the stability of orbits?
Cheers

BREATHE DEEP THE GATHERING GLOOM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by contracycle, posted 06-22-2004 6:32 AM contracycle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by contracycle, posted 06-22-2004 11:55 AM DarkStar has replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 144 of 179 (117673)
06-22-2004 9:25 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by contracycle
06-22-2004 11:55 AM


Re: Evolving Views
DS quote: I think the more important question here is why would you so close your mind to other possibilities that you would not consider it a probability, however remote?
cc writes:
Because there is not the slightest reason to go that direction.
As I said, I see no evidence of design in nature, none whatsoever. Thats just how I experience it. As you said, we are only talking about the appearance of design... where is it?
DS quote:
So then, is it your understanding that the distance between the planets, their moon(s), and the sun is irrelevant to the stability of orbits?
cc writes:
No, they directly relevant. But, what has that got to do with DESIGN?
DarkStar replies:
The arrangement, or design, of the planets in their orbits is central to the existance of life on this planet. You may then ask, "how do you know it is by design?", to which I would have to reply, I do not claim that it is "by" design, only that it "is" a design. Evidence of an order necessary for our existance. Can you state emphatically that it is not a design? What evidence can you offer to support your position?

BREATHE DEEP THE GATHERING GLOOM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by contracycle, posted 06-22-2004 11:55 AM contracycle has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Coragyps, posted 06-22-2004 9:36 PM DarkStar has replied
 Message 147 by contracycle, posted 06-23-2004 4:53 AM DarkStar has not replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 146 of 179 (117679)
06-22-2004 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Coragyps
06-22-2004 9:36 PM


Re: Evolving Views
I answered your questions, why didn't you answer mine?

BREATHE DEEP THE GATHERING GLOOM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Coragyps, posted 06-22-2004 9:36 PM Coragyps has not replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 150 of 179 (119316)
06-27-2004 10:01 PM
Reply to: Message 149 by nator
06-25-2004 10:37 AM


Somewhere Beyond Logic and Reason...........
I do not see alot of substance in your posts. You ask the same questions over and over, even after having received the answers. Perhaps you would do better to make an attempt at educating me. Please provide for me all the evidence available to you that nothing within the vastness of the entire universe shows any sign of design and/or intelligent design. Also include all evidence at your disposal that shows this intelligent designer you keep talking about could not possibly exist and therefore could not possibly have created anything.
I have concentrated on the patterns, designs, and intelligent designs but you seem fixated on having me give you some sort of evidence for an intelligent designer. So instead of me trying to offer you evidence of something I have not claimed, that being an intelligent designer, would you please provide for me the evidence that you have that an intelligent designer can not possibly exist and then once we have moved beyond that overwhelming evidence that you surely must have at your disposal, we can concentrate on the subject I was talking about.
I wonder whether you will attempt to supply me with the evidence, as it seems that a number of people in this forum have succumbed to what I like to call the "Dumbing Down Syndrome", which states, "My mind can not figure out this wonderfully amazing world in which I live. I can not possibly accept any other explanation due to the fact that a higher degree of logic and reason would bring me to a place that is just too deep for my limited concept of the universe so.......
evolution has to be the answer,
evolution has to be the answer,
evolution has to be the answer"
You are definitely not in Kansas anymore but the real question is, where are you and how close is it to the Twilight Zone?

BREATHE DEEP THE GATHERING GLOOM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 149 by nator, posted 06-25-2004 10:37 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by contracycle, posted 06-28-2004 7:10 AM DarkStar has not replied
 Message 152 by crashfrog, posted 06-28-2004 8:00 AM DarkStar has not replied
 Message 153 by nator, posted 06-28-2004 10:05 AM DarkStar has replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 154 of 179 (119587)
06-28-2004 4:08 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by nator
06-28-2004 10:05 AM


Re: Somewhere Beyond Logic and Reason...........
Why did I know your post would be as it was? Because far to many evolutionists are capable of asking question after question but seem remarkably incapable of answering them so let me phrase the question in a different manner.
What scientically confirming evidence are you aware of that any entity, including those that you recognize as being a pattern, design, or intelligent design was so constructed by natural means alone.
That is a fairly simple question, one any well educated evolutionist should be able to answer in a purely scientific manner. I await your answer with great anticipation.
If scientific evidence is capable of confirming this, then logic dictates that science will also be able to confirm that these same entities were so constructed without any reliance on an external source of power or intelligence, and were reliant on nothing which is contrary to nature in the development of their own genetic information which was necessary for the construction of any pattern, design, or intelligent design which said entity may responsible for, and that said genetic information was derived by purely natural means alone, absent any reliance upon an outside source of power or intelligence, whether it be a known or an unknown.
Cheers

BREATHE DEEP THE GATHERING GLOOM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by nator, posted 06-28-2004 10:05 AM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by crashfrog, posted 06-29-2004 3:37 AM DarkStar has not replied
 Message 160 by nator, posted 06-29-2004 11:02 AM DarkStar has not replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 174 of 179 (135117)
08-18-2004 9:38 PM


The Cancer is Spreading
Discouraging news from Kansas
With the results of the August 3, 2004, primary election, the balance of power on the Kansas Board of Education is likely to tilt in favor of anti-evolutionists, for the first time since 1999, when the board voted to de-emphasize evolution in the state's science standards. The board is presently split 5-5 between supporters and opponents of evolution education.
In District 6, Kathy Martin defeated incumbent Bruce Wyatt to become the Republican candidate. On July 11, during a candidates' forum, Martin said that evolution should be taught as a theory and alongside alternative theories such as "intelligent design," which she described as "accepted by professors around the US." Noting that evolution was the consensus view among scientists, Wyatt warned that changes to the standards such as those proposed by Martin would compromise the academic standards of Kansas’s schools: the state’s schools should "keep the science in science."
In District 10, incumbent Steve Abrams, who submitted a creationist-written version of the standards to his colleagues in 1999, defeated Tim Aiken, who reportedly supported keeping the present standards as they are, to become the Republican candidate. In Districts 2 and 8, moderate Republican incumbents Sue Gamble and Carol Rupe, supporters of evolution education, ran unopposed, apparently because their would-be conservative Republican rivals missed a filing deadline by seconds.
Martin, Abrams, Gamble, and Rupe are running unopposed in the general election. The only contested seat will be in District 4, where incumbent Democrat Bill Wagnon, a supporter of evolution education, is running against Republican Robert Meissner, whose views on evolution education have not been reported.
It is thus likely that anti-evolutionists will have at least a 6-4 majority on the board, which will be reviewing a revision of the state science standards -- presently under development -- in 2005.
(Story in The Witchita Eagle)
August 4, 2004
http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/news/...
{Shortened display form of URL, to restore page width to normal - AM}
Today's question is: What is the difference between an anti-evolutionist and a pro-creationist?
The answer: A Dark Star
Yes people.....there is a center in the spectrum of logic and reason.
This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 08-20-2004 08:37 PM

The theory of evolution is a viable theory, absent the myth of macroevolution.
Once the myth of macroevolution is included, the viability of the theory of evolution vanishes as it slowly evolves into just another example of an implausible story,
nestled amongst the numerous fairytale's of our youth.-----DarkStar

Replies to this message:
 Message 175 by crashfrog, posted 08-19-2004 1:37 AM DarkStar has replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 176 of 179 (135811)
08-20-2004 9:17 PM
Reply to: Message 175 by crashfrog
08-19-2004 1:37 AM


Re: The Cancer is Spreading
Would that all the actual scientists who can confirm how truly wrong you are could engage you in an actual debate. Perhaps then we could all watch and see the frog crash and burn.
However, I am convinced that you would simply dismiss all scientists who do not believe in this myth of macroevolution that you hold so near and dear to your heart, regardless of how many degrees, doctorates, etc. those scientists may hold.
I know for a certainty that there is absolutely no solid scientific evidence confirming macroevolution. There are imperfect speculations, unfounded assumptions, fallacious inferences, superfluous guesswork, and a hell of a lot of wishful thinking, but absolutely no unquestionable scientific evidence whatsoever. None, nada, zip, zero.
If there was even one, just one solid piece of scientific evidence confirming that macroevolution is not a myth, which it most surely is, there would not be any controversy, no ongoing debate. The reason there is controversy, the reason there is debate, is because macroevolution can not be confirmed. No one will ever be able to confirm something that obviously has never happened.
No matter how hard neo-evo's try, they simply are unable to convince anyone who is willing to excercise true common sense, logic, and reason, that macroevolution has ever occurred, is occurring now, or will occur in the future.
This is one of the reasons we have thousands of condemnatory quotes from evolution scientists about macroevolution. They apparently hold to their professional opinions, posting them in various writings, while condemning the very concept of Darwinian macroevolution outside of those same papers, journals, etc., a fact that is made quite evident by the thousands of quotes which, so far, no neo-evo has been able to prove were taken out of context to mean something other than what the scientists actually said, and meant.
Macroevolution is a myth!
I know it, thousands of scientists know it.
Get over it and move on to real science, real evolution.

The theory of evolution is a viable theory, absent the myth of macroevolution.
Once the myth of macroevolution is included, the viability of the theory of evolution vanishes as it slowly evolves into just another example of an implausible story,
nestled amongst the numerous fairytale's of our youth.-----DarkStar

This message is a reply to:
 Message 175 by crashfrog, posted 08-19-2004 1:37 AM crashfrog has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 177 by CK, posted 08-20-2004 9:19 PM DarkStar has replied
 Message 179 by crashfrog, posted 08-21-2004 1:32 AM DarkStar has not replied

  
DarkStar
Inactive Member


Message 178 of 179 (135825)
08-20-2004 9:59 PM
Reply to: Message 177 by CK
08-20-2004 9:19 PM


Re: The Cancer is Spreading
You are truly entitled to your own opinion, no matter how wrong that opinion makes you. However, please feel free to expand on any quote that is given in my "own" thread, offering your own evidence supporting the assertion that any of the quotes given are taken so out of context that a false understanding of what is actually being said is automatic, and that the scientist who is quoted condemning Darwinian evolution did not actually mean what he, or she, said.
I am not against you, or anyone for that matter, offering a fuller text of any quote offered in order to better support their own position. Short of that, any complaints about quotes from scientists making condemnatory statements regarding the myth of macroevolution will have little impact.

The theory of evolution is a viable theory, absent the myth of macroevolution.
Once the myth of macroevolution is included, the viability of the theory of evolution vanishes as it slowly evolves into just another example of an implausible story,
nestled amongst the numerous fairytale's of our youth.-----DarkStar

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by CK, posted 08-20-2004 9:19 PM CK has not replied

  
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