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Author Topic:   Ring species as evidence for speciation
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 764 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 37 of 53 (120167)
06-29-2004 10:08 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by Steen
06-29-2004 9:16 PM


Re: Back to ring species
Another nice example of a ring species are the greenish warblers that pretty much circle the Tibetan plateau. There are five subspecies, that sort of intergrade into each other - except that the two sorts that share some territory in Siberia don't recognize each others' songs, and don't interbreed. I don't think the paper with the details is online (other than pay-per-view) but the citation is Irwin, et al., Nature 409, 333 - 337 (18 January 2001).

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 764 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 47 of 53 (177120)
01-14-2005 7:39 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by RAZD
01-13-2005 11:52 PM


are there any instances where all adjacent species can mate but opposite sides can't?
The greenish warblers, five subspecies of which form a ring clear around Tibet, are like that. The two subspecies that meet in Russia don't recognize each other's songs and don't interbreed, where the others all intergrade at their borders. I've posted on them somewhere here in the past, or I can find the reference again if you'd like.
Added by edit:
http://www.zoology.ubc.ca/~irwin/Greenish%20warblers.html
does nicely...
This message has been edited by Coragyps, 01-14-2005 19:45 AM

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 764 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 50 of 53 (182935)
02-03-2005 6:23 PM
Reply to: Message 49 by RAZD
01-15-2005 10:08 AM


Re: nice article
The folks that published previously on the greenish warblers have some new work out: Irwin, et al., Science, Vol 307, 414-416, 21 January 2005. It gets into genetic measures of how all the warblers in the ring differ, and find that, sure enough, the two northernmost subspecies differ the most, even though their ranges overlap.
From 105 greenish warblers at 26 sites throughout the breeding range we obtained 62 AFLP markers that were variable and could be scored unambiguously as present or absent in each individual. West Siberian viridanus and east Siberian plumbeitarsus are clearly separated in AFLP genotypes, which confirms that the two taxa are genetically distinct. In contrast, AFLP genotypes change gradually through the ring of populations to the south (Fig. 1).

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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 764 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 52 of 53 (182959)
02-03-2005 9:34 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by RAZD
02-03-2005 9:18 PM


Re: nice article
The gap is apparently from recent habitat destruction - birds to either side of it overlap genetically as much as any of the other southern neighbors, judging from the published graphs. Whether they mean "recent" as "Holocene" or as "in the past few centuries" isn't clear.

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