Honorable Opponents

I have a question for both creationists and evolutionists. Because this is such a great debate, there are many that add their voice to it who have neither the knowledge nor awareness to make any such dialogue more fulfilling. My question is this:
Evolutionists, which creationists writers do you consider honest, informed and respectable opponents. Creationists, which evolutionists do you view as being respectable opponents. Even though each side disagrees with the other there exist honorable individuals from both sides. Let's identify them and give them their credit. Who do you respect from the other side, and what makes you respect them?ApostleAlso congratulations to Montreal Member of Parliament Irwin Cotler who was named federal Justice Minister. He is the first Jewish Justice Minister of Canada.[This message has been edited by Apostle, 12-14-2003]

AsgaraMy original intention was just to make mention of well known opponents in the public spotlight. But I like where this has gone.
At the evc forum, on the evolutionist side, I enjoy the comments given by Nosyned, Darwinsterrier, Mammathus, and Zhimbo. As for creationists, I was not aware there were any, for they have never come to my defence. I am curious to know how individuals view a creationist like Phillip Johnson, or Henry Morris. In my opinion these are two of the more respected, widely known creationists.Apostle

Schrafinator,I do not think that I have heard from you before.From my perspective, Dr. Henry Morris seems like a respectable man. While you may disagree with him, to keep this conversation going, you will have to give examples of his misquoting. Also the 'religious wacko' comment is unnecessary and perhaps not accurate.Are there any creationist writers that you do enjoy reading from?Respectfully,
Apostle

I assume you are speaker as an administrator on this matter, in which case I will respect your judgement. However I am not against talking in detail about some of the various authors on this particular post.
Also I noticed that you stated that Phillip Johnson was closer to being an evolutionist that a young earth creationist. Interestingly another individual stated that Michael Behe was 99 % evolutionist. I ask this with no malice intended, but why do you assume that the creationists who have a deep knowledge of science and who can defend their own beliefs well, are more evolutionist?
Phillip Johnson speaks of evolution synonomysly (I realize that is spelled wrong) with materialism. He states at times that most evolutionists see know difference between their materialist beliefs and their evolutionary beliefs. Do you agree with him on this?
When I read Phillip Johnson's works, I do not see an evolutionist.
Apostle

Truthlover
Whether or not Lyell studied law for his parents sake is irrelevent to me. If he took the necessary steps to becoming a lawyer, for whatever reason, he is still a lawyer. Having said that, Charles Lyell is known to all familiar with him, as a geologist. For Morris to refer to him as a lawyer, does not constitute as a lie, and certainly does not lead me to the conclusion that he has an honesty problem.
Apostle

"Perhaps someone could should a fre paragraphs of Morris's so we could judge."
That would indeed be helpful.
Apostle

If that is the quote you are referring to then that is indeed one thing. However, you did not give specifics the first time. Because of that I assumed that you took issue with only what you mentioned. I state my opinion that to say Lyell was a lawyer is not a lie, and then you give me the quote you were talking about (but neglected to give originally) and say that I am killing you. You would survive longer, assuming you are still in the process of being killed, if you would be more clear and specific the first time you mention something.I find your admiration of Ken Ham as an opponent very interesting. Do you know others who also feel as you do about him? I am only curious for I only hear the worst of him from evolutionists. The only individual that seems to be liked less than Ham is the infamous Kent Hovind.Apostle

One of my favorite authors in the Creation/Evolution debate is one Gerald Schroeder. He is relatively unknown,though he is relatively unknown. Three of his works are, 'Genesis and the Big Bang,' 'The Hidden Face of God,' and my personal favorite, 'The Science of God.'The problem is, I do not no where to classify him. A strong defender of Intelligent Design, yet he also speaks with certainty about the Big Bang. An obvious Biblical scholar, but he concedes that Adam may have had parents.Despite my many disagreements with him, I find his books very interesting.On the creationist side, what do evolutionists think of Dr.Duane Gish. I believe he is now deceased, though I am not certain. He and Henry Morris were at one point THE CREATIONISTS. Times have changed and a new generation has relaced them, but I still wonder. What do honest people think of Duane Gish? I add the word honest because I know some evolutionists who will assassinate the character of an individual once it becomes known they are a Creationist. This was done with Dr.Morris, Dr. Gish and many of today's creationists. (Not a physical assassination of coarse, but the use of an ad hominen arguement). Evolutionists are not alone in this of coarse, for many creationists are also responsible.Apostle

The statement alone says little, or perhaps more about you than Gish. If you wish to convince anyone I would strongly suggest you back up your opinions with examples.
Apostle