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Author Topic:   Randman's call for nonSecular education...
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 226 (259441)
11-13-2005 8:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Silent H
11-13-2005 4:02 AM


randman writes:
The simple fact unless one understands the theological movements that shaped Western history, and understands them from the believer's perpsective so that the motive of these movements is clear, one doesn't understand basic history.
Of course the theological movements themselves were shaped by historical events and struggle with other theological movements...in fact, "theological" movements were usually political movements that used religion as a justification.
It would, indeed, be a worthwhile endeavor to show how Western religious belief and thought has been the result of a continuous unfolding of political and social history. I suspect that it might be a little deep for grade school kids, although I would love to see the look on the faces of evangelical parents as their own theology is exposed as a method of indoctrinating a particular political agenda.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Silent H, posted 11-13-2005 4:02 AM Silent H has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 24 of 226 (259653)
11-14-2005 1:49 PM
Reply to: Message 23 by randman
11-14-2005 12:43 PM


Re: didn't read the whole post yet
quote:
For example, it is more important to understand the US government and Constitution, for American kids than to understand Japan's.
I don't know about that. World War II, including the Pacific Theater, is an important part of US history; probably the most important event in the 20th century. How does one understand WWII without understanding why the Japanese were expanding in East Asia, or why they attacked the naval base in Hawaii? And how does one understand this without spending significant time studying historical Japanese culture?

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 23 by randman, posted 11-14-2005 12:43 PM randman has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 33 of 226 (259710)
11-14-2005 5:37 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Silent H
11-14-2005 5:20 PM


quote:
Xianity was on both sides of the slave issue. Xianity was on both sides of suffrage. Xianity was on both sides of Civil Rights. Xianity was on both sides of the Revolution.
And these divisions generally split denominations, too, not just Christianity in general. To discuss the role of "Christian principles" in shaping the US one would need to discuss how, for example, Christians could use "Christian principles" to oppose slavery, while other Christians could use the very same "Christian principles" to support it. I doubt that evangelicals would be very happy with a curriculum that would lead to the obvious conclusion that there are no real "Christian principles' -- that Christianity is pretty much what the individual believer brings into it.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Silent H, posted 11-14-2005 5:20 PM Silent H has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Silent H, posted 11-14-2005 5:41 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 71 of 226 (259945)
11-15-2005 12:32 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by randman
11-15-2005 12:03 PM


Like including the Germans killed by the Red Army during WWII?
This message has been edited by Chiroptera, 15-Nov-2005 05:33 PM

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by randman, posted 11-15-2005 12:03 PM randman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 72 by randman, posted 11-15-2005 1:04 PM Chiroptera has not replied

Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 137 of 226 (260218)
11-16-2005 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 136 by jar
11-16-2005 11:42 AM


Re: OK, let's teach the Bible in public schools
quote:
...And even to the realization that there is not even something that can be called THE Christianity or THE Bible.
Even worse, from the fundamentalist point-of-view, and as you continue to point out yourself, is that there isn't even a single, clearly correct interpretation of any of part of THE Bible, even if there were such a thing as THE Bible. Hell, I was sliding toward social and economic liberalism and pacifism from reading the Gospels literally back when I was a fundamentalist.

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by jar, posted 11-16-2005 11:42 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by jar, posted 11-16-2005 11:59 AM Chiroptera has not replied

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