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Author
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Topic: The concept of faith
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 86 of 116 (311682)
05-13-2006 12:57 AM
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Reply to: Message 85 by Faith
05-12-2006 6:54 PM
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Re: Believing without seeing
I'm tired of arguing it.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 85 by Faith, posted 05-12-2006 6:54 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 87 by Faith, posted 05-13-2006 1:49 AM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 88 of 116 (311685)
05-13-2006 1:58 AM
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Reply to: Message 87 by Faith
05-13-2006 1:49 AM
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Re: Believing without seeing
On the other hand, the literary virtues of the Bible are many. Certain passages often drift through my thoughts.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 87 by Faith, posted 05-13-2006 1:49 AM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 89 by Faith, posted 05-13-2006 2:01 AM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 91 of 116 (311688)
05-13-2006 2:13 AM
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Reply to: Message 89 by Faith
05-13-2006 2:01 AM
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Re: Believing without seeing
I prefer King James myself. I don't care if it's "accurate" or not. "Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also." Anyone with the least bit of verbal sensitivity can appreciate that.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 89 by Faith, posted 05-13-2006 2:01 AM | | Faith has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 92 by robinrohan, posted 05-13-2006 2:38 AM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Re: Believing without seeing
Or this: "Remember now thy Creator in the days of thy youth, while the evil days come not, nor the years draw nigh, when thou shalt say, I have no pleasure in them. While the sun, or the light, or the moon, or the stars, be not darkened, nor the clouds return after the rain. . . . (and then he switches to the "evil days") Also when they shall be afraid of that which is high, and fears shall be in the way, and the almond tree shall flourish, and the grasshopper shall be a burden, and desire shall fail: because man goeth to his long home, and the mourners go about the streets."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 91 by robinrohan, posted 05-13-2006 2:13 AM | | robinrohan has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 93 by Faith, posted 05-14-2006 12:56 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 95 of 116 (312053)
05-15-2006 3:38 PM
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Reply to: Message 93 by Faith
05-14-2006 12:56 PM
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Re: Bible literary appreciation OT
What part does the meaning of those passages play in your appreciation? In the quote from the NT, very litte. In the quote from Eccles., quite a bit. But I wonder why the almond tree flourishes when everything else is crumbling away? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 93 by Faith, posted 05-14-2006 12:56 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 97 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 4:16 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 96 of 116 (312057)
05-15-2006 3:44 PM
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Reply to: Message 94 by iano
05-14-2006 4:54 PM
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1. God must present compelling (although indirect) evidence of the fact that all the roads a person has followed in attempt to buttress their own independance and pursuit of happiness, have not in fact resulted in that goal being achieved. Masks only. He must show them that for all their attempts at self-fulfillment, they have not filled the desire that all this stuff is aimed at filling. A person is 'nearer' if they at least see this about themselves. Many deny that there is a void in their life at all. If a person DOES arrive at this point then it wasn't them that brings that revelation about their position. He is showing them that this stuff doesn't cut it. He is holding up the reality of their lives for their evaluation. . 2. A person must not deny (past the point of no return) the conclusion that would be drawn from this evidence. One can of course shake off the notions that would hint at this conclusion and continue to attempt to fill the void with 'stuff'. We are afterall, free to deny and ignore the evidence. To not face it. To turn away from it. I guess this could be called the "moral argument" for the existence of God. I wonder if that could be put into a moral logical form. The basic idea seems to be that we can deduce the existence of God from our sense of wrong-doing: the argument from conscience. Does one need a God to have a conscience? I think you need one to have an objective conscience. That is to say, assuming no God, there's no grounding for morals. It's just a matter of feelings. The issue would be whether our sense of morals is objective, for if it is subjective, it means nothing as for as being evidence for anything.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 94 by iano, posted 05-14-2006 4:54 PM | | iano has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 98 by iano, posted 05-15-2006 7:01 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 99 of 116 (312232)
05-15-2006 10:52 PM
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Reply to: Message 98 by iano
05-15-2006 7:01 PM
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I don't see how one could ever deduce it. The whole point is to deduce it. In that case, why believe it? Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 98 by iano, posted 05-15-2006 7:01 PM | | iano has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 100 of 116 (312235)
05-15-2006 11:00 PM
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Reply to: Message 99 by robinrohan
05-15-2006 10:52 PM
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However, iano
I have to agree that people around here don't care about deduction or induction: what they care about is politics. That's what drives this show. Well, you know what, iano? I don't care about politics.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 99 by robinrohan, posted 05-15-2006 10:52 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 103 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:04 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 102 of 116 (312238)
05-15-2006 11:04 PM
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Reply to: Message 101 by Faith
05-15-2006 11:02 PM
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Uh, no. You have to logically deduce it. The testimony means nothing.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 101 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:02 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 104 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:06 PM | | robinrohan has not replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 105 of 116 (312244)
05-15-2006 11:09 PM
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Reply to: Message 103 by Faith
05-15-2006 11:04 PM
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Re: However, iano
Yes, the reason Percy started this site was to defeat the political moves of the creationists to have a say in the schools I think Percy is an honorable man. That's been my impression.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 103 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:04 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 106 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:13 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 108 of 116 (312256)
05-15-2006 11:21 PM
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Reply to: Message 106 by Faith
05-15-2006 11:13 PM
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Re: However, iano
I didn't say it was dishonorable, merely reminding you that politics was the reason for this site. If it's political, it's dishonorable. But you understand, this is my extremely humble opinion.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 106 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:13 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 109 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:53 PM | | robinrohan has replied |
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robinrohan
Inactive Member
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Message 110 of 116 (312273)
05-15-2006 11:57 PM
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Reply to: Message 109 by Faith
05-15-2006 11:53 PM
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Re: However, iano
Oh well, allrighty then. Whatever you do, don't make any definite statements. Edited by robinrohan, : No reason given.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 109 by Faith, posted 05-15-2006 11:53 PM | | Faith has not replied |
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