Smart People?

Did you actually read your own replies, especially about the apes? What have apes got to do with spelling of language?Did you read the OP? It is concerned only with spelling and makes the point that spelling is not so important because the mind does not read the whole word, just the first and last letter. A fascinating concept, don't you think?
However, it does not prove to be the case in this thread at all.

First of all, let me make it clear that I think your writing is fine. I don't know why people have pointed out your mistakes in the past.With that said, the word "judgment" is spelled without an "e" in the middle. Ok, sorry, simply couldn't resist The reason we care about people's attitude toward their writing is the same reason we care about people who decide to go to meetings and whatnot wearing ragged clothing and unshaven for days. Sure, if that's their choice to not shave for days and look like a rag, I guess it's their freedom to do so. But we'd have to ask if they really respect us at all. I don't know. Can you give a few specific links? Personally, I haven't noticed you that much. Admittedly, some people do that.

Yes. I was suggesting that they might soon overtake some human beings in their general abilities to express themselves in language.Search | The Ohio State University BBC NEWS | Entertainment | Chimp display is Biennale 'hit' Yes. Wrong. That Cambridge research makes the point that we read in whole words, and that we can still recognise the words if the letters are jumbled up as long as the first and last letters are in their correct place.The rcreerash clniatrey deos not ilpmy taht tlbirree snillepg is eulalqy esay to raed as pcfreet slilnpeg.It's old research, and there's an old EvC thread on it somewhere.You then ask in the O.P. why people complain about your spelling, and when some of us point out that posts can be easier to read if spelling and grammar are at a good standard, you seem to show chimp-like speed in understanding the point.Here you are, expressing yourself again. Spelling and grammar, great, but English comprehension, apparently not so good. It is cd oy wh sg ad ms te pt tt sg....etc.You see? The mind reads more than the first and last letter. Message 31, and you haven't yet understood the contents of your own O.P.

Ah, so it's now compulsory to be American, is it? Sorry, simply couldn't resist.

Do you believe that an English major is smarter than a rocket scientist?By the initial post, i believe the author is pointing out that someone who cant read or write can possibly play Bach better than Bach. That the content of what is written is more valuable than the structure of the grammar.Too many, like you (apparently), Are so anal about the written style, that content is ignored. Perhaps its just your pet peeve. Either way, the content per individual still may have some importance. Even if you think the person is a complete fool.Fools humble the wise. Because from the lips of fools comes a simple wisdom. And the wise get so arrogant about their wisdom, They can be more foolish than a fool. And perceived to have still said something wise.No one knows all things. And every individual has experienced or been subject to a knowledge that only that person has gained. It is wise to treat all people with the same dignity and respect you desire for yourself. You never know, when the one you have belittled, may one day be a fireman that saves you and your families life. Or a nurse, who saves your baby when all other doctors and nurses had no clue what to do, and had claimed the baby would die.I can not practise perfection. But i can practise improvement.

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keep your mind from this way of enquiry, for never will you show that not-being is
~parmenides

Happy to oblige. This is the problem. You make it about you! You can't make it past your own judgements (I like it better spelled this way). If you want respect then you have to earn it. The same rules apply whoever you are. Do you think good spelling and good grooming deserve respect?To be honest, I don't feel much respect for your judgements at all, and it makes it difficult for me not to judge you as you judge others. But this is not a personal vendetta and not about me. It is about how the mind works with the written word.The Op makes two points.
1. The correct spelling is not as important as many believe.
2. It is the Judgement itself (of incorrect spelling) that distracts from the concept and not neccessarily the spelling.If you read the misspelled passage with ease, then this would support point 1.
If your mind is concerned only with the spelling and doesn't grasp the concept, then it supports point 2.From the replies, I see nothing to suggest anyone had difficulty reading the misspelled passage, so the communication was not a problem.
However, it seems the concept was lost! Who is responsible for the breakdown in this communication? The author or the reader?

As is true of everything, there are certain levels of respect. Some are earned, and some are given.The people in my office did not have to earn my respect of not wearing ragged clothing into the office. The same goes with probably everyone that I meet out in the street.And then there is the level of respect that have to be earned. There hasn't been any judgment from my end. Like I said before, I haven't noticed you at all before I noticed this thread.But what I said about respect stands.

Misspellings and grammatical errors can be distracting. When I see people using "their" instead of "they're" or vice-versa, I really have to stop in my tracks and go back to the begining of the phrase to make sure I haven't missundertood something. When I find out I haven't missunderstood anything, I realise I'm dealing with a dope, get annoyed, and feel tempted to skip the post all together. A simple misspelled word isn't that bad, but it does catch my eye, distracts me and makes me loose some time getting back on track.

Sometimes. Intelligence is not necessarily tied to your chosen field. Would Einstein have been less intelligent had he been an author instead of a physicist? With some individuals, "style" is so poor that "content" is never effectively carried across. The purpose of writing is communication. If your writing style is so horrific as to prevent anyone from being able to understand what you are saying, your "writing style" is at fault.Poor writing style, especially when it involves jumbled and incomplete thoughts, can be representative of jumbled and incomplete thought patterns. If you write sufficiently poorly, it's likely that you don't think very clearly either. Whatever makes you feel better. There are different types and levels of respect. Respect can be earned, it can be given, and it can also be lost. A good way to lose my respect as a poster is to show a complete inability to learn or communicate even simple thoughts. And I have no respect for religious beliefs themselves (though I respect the right of a person to hold to those beliefs, and would never change that). You could begin by spelling "practice" correctly.

I am actually referring to judgement in general, but like I said you can't get past it. You have not mentioned anything else. I give up. regards

I had to come back to this as no-one would spell in this manner. Most of us read with the sound in mind. This is how children learn. How the hell would anyone read this and comprehend it without the natural sound of the word being in your mind? Your incorrect spelling is designed to deliberately be misleading. Most people try to spell correctly.Edited by pelican, : No reason given.Edited by pelican, : No reason given.

I can understand the distraction, however there and their and they're can easily be comprehended in context.
I don't understand how you can judge someone a dope.It seems all objections to incorrect spelling is from personal judgements and frustrations and nothing to do with the author.

I have no idea where you got this from. It wasn't in my OP. What do you mean by anal? Do you mean this? I am not the one fixated on correct spelling, if that is what you are inferring. I absolutely agree.

My phrase obeys the same rules as the piece you quoted in the O.P.The point I was making is that the Cambridge research does not mean that bad spelling isn't a hindrance to communication. It merely shows that we can decipher misspellings quite easily if the first and last letters of the words are correctly placed.In the O.P. you say: If you hadn't used the word "good" there, then I wouldn't have disagreed. Correct spelling certainly isn't paramount to communication, but standardized spellings certainly help with the speed of understanding, and make basic communication into "good" communication.I don't think anyone here is objecting to the occasional typo or misspelling, as we all make them. But sometimes we get posters who almost seem to make an effort to slow the readers' understanding down. You don't seem to be one of them, judging by this thread.Incidentally, your judgement on the word "judgement" is correct, as it's the normal spelling just about everywhere except for the U.S., as I hinted to Taz, above. Be a proud Aussie and use Aussie spelling! Don't let our ethnocentric American friends colour your judgement (or color your judgment).

Most things can absolutely be comprehended in context, however, it does require that those who understand and use the correct spellings, parts of speech, possessive terms, definitions (in context), punctuation and whole words themselves make an extra effort to comprehend what the author is trying to convey (which most of us usually do, but are we not allowed to vent our own frustrations?).Many times, here on EvC and elsewhere, the author misuses many or most/all of the above and that makes it very difficult for the readers to get what the author is trying to say.It becomes a great annoyance when others take the time to correct the more egregious mistakes and the abuser refuses to learn. This can trickle down to the smaller mistakes (e.g. they're, their, there) because someone who won't correct their smaller mistakes can almost certainly be counted upon to completely ignore corrections of their larger ones.Obvious typos are easily forgiven (the subtitle above, for instance) and we all make them, no matter what our education level.Occasionally disorganized posts can also be easily forgiven. We all have days/nights when we are distracted, drunk, lacking sleep, annoyed and/or emotionally charged (I have been guilty of all of the above recently).It is the consistently sloppy and disorganized posts which grate on the nerves of those who want to participate in educated debates or, at least, hope that what they say gets acknowledged. Sadly, this does not often happen. Those who persist in using incorrect definitions, spellings and grammar, despite correction, often won't retain the pertinent information in detailed posts.One reason for this, IMO, is that they already had a reply in mind before any response to their initial questions and their eyes just glaze over any perceived irrelevancies (the definitions of "theory" and "singularity" come to mind).Another reason could be (and has been brought up in this thread) is that sloppy writing often reveals sloppy thinking. Especially when the author has the luxury of a leisurely response, like in internet debate boards.A few initial (or occasional) gaffes are usually overlooked, but it is when it becomes a pattern that others will begin to call you on it. Also, corrections are not reserved for the opposition...if you look through this forum you will find many people on the same "side" correcting and calling each other on their more obvious and/or consistent mistakes.Many posters here actually encourage correction and are grateful when someone dispels a misconception that they had.I am grateful for the chance to learn here. I try not to take it personally when I am corrected and I back off and take the opportunity learn when I realize I am over my head (which is a lot). The frustrations part is true, but I haven't often seen someone attacking someone else for poor spelling or grammar right off the bat without addressing their first post(s).It usually comes after a period of reading almost incoherent posts and trying to pick out the relevant pieces. Then, after a few rounds of this, the attacks on spelling and grammar and definitions come.Whenever I see these "attacks," I see it as an opportunity for the guilty party to try to present a more coherent argument. Why not take it? If they don't and they, instead, insist on repeating the same mistakes, then we can rightly call them a "sloppy thinker."If someone can present a coherent argument and then continually misuses a term or spelling, they should still be expected to be called on it (NJ's usage of "specie" comes to mind) and correct it because it does detract from the point if the terminology isn't right (it shows a lack of understanding).My last point is that I would take it as a sign of interest in what I have to say if someone asked me for clarification. It can often come across as snide and "superior," but it is in your best interest (as a participant on this forum and for your own general knowledge) to absorb the advice given to you, let the "attitude" roll off of your back and re-present your argument using the new knowledge you have gained.Unless, you (general "you") are just basking in the frustration of others and/or don't care and won't hear a word anyone says, much less me.In that case, I expect a similar thread to be started shortly by someone else who feels slighted for their inability to be understood.

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"You are metaphysicians. You can prove anything by metaphysics; and having done so, every metaphysician can prove every other metaphysician wrong--to his own satisfaction. You are anarchists in the realm of thought. And you are mad cosmos-makers. Each of you dwells in a cosmos of his own making, created out of his own fancies and desires. You do not know the real world in which you live, and your thinking has no place in the real world except in so far as it is phenomena of mental aberration." -The Iron Heel by Jack London"Hazards exist that are not marked" - some bar in Chelsea