Paging johnfolton. Bring your evidence for a young earth.

Coyote,Ned would not allow biblical stuff to be included in a debate on the age of the earth, universe. Its like the appearance of age but not the age of the earth. Like biblically you have 4,000 years where excess gamma photon radiation could of been happening explaining accelerated radioactive decay. You have the biblical flood satisfying the sediment layerings happening suddenly approximately 5,400 years ago. No native hoof creature in australia because all perished in the world flood. The fossil record is the creatures destroyed in the world flood. The massive coal yards evidence of a world flood that the bible is inerrant. The glaciers of the northern hemisphere evidence of the biblical flood that happened in the winter in the northern hemisphere.P.S. I don't think you would accept the bible inferences nor accept Walt Browns information so a debate probably would be only going down you saying a biblical flood is a myth and me saying its evidence that a the sediment layers are no older than 5,400 years. We just see the evidence differently not sure if Humphreys take on space dilation is the same as mine but makes sense that the galaxies are young because if they would be old they would of unwound long ago. galaxies and the earth young due space dilation, that the earth probably the entire milkey way and all galaxies are jumping every 24 hours 1000 years forward in spacetime, etc...!Like if earth time since the creation has been 13,000 years that times 365 times 13,000 years if spacetime dilation distances are increasing at the rate of a thousand year to a day 2 peter 3:8 you have spacetime dilation calculated distance across the universe for the last 13,000 years equalling approximately 61,685,000,000 light years for an universe only 13,000 years old.A day is as a thousand years is why galaxies have not yet unwound is because the galaxies are young not old as the creationists have been saying all along, etc...P.S.God and God alone is spreading out the heavens. Is 62 billion light years about right as far as how old you believe the visible universe is?Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

Well I've already presented the bible as evidence you have at least 13,000 years since the sun became a star and 4,000 of those years before it was placed at the present distance from the earth thus a change in gamma radiation and photon emission is my theory how rapid accelerated decay could easily be accounted for. Like in the beginning was the earth radioactive and needed to be purged by accelerated decay as well as the waters heated to create the atmosphere and the seas.You wanted evidence and I gave you the galaxies spirals indicate the milkey way and all galaxies are young because they have not unwound. The earth is part of a galaxy so I brought up space dilation which is just a theory to explain how the universe too explain how its possible for the galaxies to wound up and the vast distances between galaxies. Can you explain why galaxies have not yet unwound not just those close to the earths milkey way but those vast distances from the earth by anything other than space dilation? It makes sense with the expansion the stretching out of the heavens the stars have room to unwind yet they have not as yet unwound are the galaxies themselves evidence of an young earth by the universe itself being young. With just 13,000 years you have by spacetime dilation off 2 peter 3:8 gives you approximately 65 billion light years of stretching yet a universe only 13,000 years of age! Maybe this thread should be in the free for all where the bible and theories like how come galaxies are not unwound like space dilation, and the bible like you have 4,000 years where the sun could of been giving off massive gamma photon radiation like purging the earth of toxic radiation by accelerated decay before life could be created on day 3,4 & 5. iN Theory no different than the patents of how to treat nucleur wastes right?The RATE Boys believe accelerated decay happened they have not said how yet but personally believe they have tied their hands by believing in 24 hour creation days. If you look to the bible you have 1000 year days those first 6 days plenty of time for accelerated decay and it makes sense the earth would have to go thru accelerated decay or life as we know it would died by radiation.With accelerated decay you have an appearance of age but not the age of the earth! right? Primordial polonium halo's overlaying means in the beginning before the rocks hardened into granite that radon could not of been the daughter to polonium forming these particular concentric overlaying alpha signatures that means the earth in its beginning had primordial polonium meaning a radioactive earth in those early days of the earth that was in need of remedial accelerated decay those first 4 creation days in the creation as the RATE Boys believe had to of happened.Uniformitarians like to believe the decay rate was the same in the past this is a belief but whent he sun first became a star did God use the suns gamma radiation to purge the earth in accelerated decay. The RATE Boys suggests the flood because they look at the first creation days as 24 hour those that see those first creation days as 1000 year days have no need to go to the flood for the time to purge the earth of toxic radiation. It makes more sense that the radioactive early earth was purged by the suns gamma radiation no different that how scientists today want to accelerate decay of nucleur wastes however when the sun became a star 13,000 years ago not during the flood is the window of time for accerated decay.Oh Well think the subject of the young age of the earth is too big to be just on the dating forum perhaps the free for all? Its like you want science to be put in a box so you can have an old earth.

Gamma radiation is said to be highly absorbable especially with high atomic number and density materials and believed the exited part of the nucleus energy thats expelled as gamma radiation when an alpha particle is expelled.Its how scientists are proposing remedial accelerated decay patents of nucleur wastes. The sun is the logical source of massive amounts of gamma radiation and from a creationists point of view you have thousands of years of potential accelerated decay of the elements. It says the creation of the heaven and the earth. Its just seems logical the creation of the earth involved remedial accelerated decay otherwise the earth would not support life. right? The bible talks of the creation of the earth which is the soil. right? It talks of the creation of the heaven which is the atmosphere. right?I mean you can not have life without an atmosphere nor with soil thats as radioactive as nucleur wastes. I mean you would not grow your garden in the wastes from a nucleur reactor would you? Presently you have the atmosphere shielding us from gamma radiation. right? No reason to believe the early earth had an atmosphere to protect it from gamma radiation. right? etc....++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Gamma decay
Gamma rays are often produced alongside other forms of radiation such as alpha or beta. When a nucleus emits an or particle, the daughter nucleus is sometimes left in an excited state. It can then jump down to a lower level by emitting a gamma ray in much the same way that an atomic electron can jump to a lower level by emitting visible light or ultraviolet radiationShielding for gamma rays requires large amounts of mass. The material used for shielding takes into account that gamma rays are better absorbed by materials with high atomic number and high density.Answers - The Most Trusted Place for Answering Life's QuestionsRemedial treatment of nucleur wastes are looking to gamma radiation, proton acceleration, higher magnetic fields, photons " not neutrons or alpha radiation" to accelerate uranium decay rates, to treat nuke wastes, etc...nukwastpatsIn a few major bursts, the sun produces gamma rays with energies up to one million electron volts. The interaction of high-energy electrons, protons, and nuclei of the sun, emit the rays.SMGAELS | Play to GainEdited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

Would not a photon go into the atom as a whole not just the electron shield inducing not forcing the atom nucleus into an exicted state that reduces this state by the expulsion of an alpha particle and the energy is it not removed as a gamma ray?

I've already said the more appropriate time for accelerated decay was when the earth atmosphere was not fully developed shielding the earths waters. But perhaps some transfering of photons happened due the canopy above is believed to rain down upon the earths sediments. Perhaps the RATE Boys are onto something? Cool!!!!!!!P.S. So there you have it the heat necessary to create the atmosphere canopy above the firmament also water is known to absorb gamma radiation. If the earth was being bombarded by gamma photons water might play a part of transferring gamma photons from the electron shield of water into the nucleus of atoms of heavy elements in need of accelerated decay. Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

Well you have to prove photons don't affect the nucleus inducing from the inside out. Its like inducing vomiting by taking Ipecac so your being induced from inside out, etc...Ipecac has been used by individuals with bulimia nervosa as a means to achieve weight loss through induced defensive vomiting.Syrup of ipecac - Wikipedia

When the alpha particle is emitted the energy removed not the particle is a gamma ray. Gamma rays don't heat particles up much which would not of heated up the earth. Even so you have a whole world of water to heat up so any heat from the alpha particle would of been welcome in the beginning supporting the creation of the heaven (the atmosphere). Heat rises escapes to space water returns to the earth its why the earth temp is so regulated. Spend a night in a desert it gets hot but at night it gets very cool because the earth releases heat upward and the earth cools rapidly. right?---------------------------------------------------------------The Gamma Sterilization AdvantageUnlike heat sterilization or steam sterilization, Gamma ray sterilization does not significantly increase the temperature of the products and therefore can be used to sterilize safely even the heat sensitive materials as well as materials in frozen condition.Page not found - Industrial Research and Development Institute++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ You have evidence of tropical plants thriving in the seas over the North Pole yet no evidence it affected the plants at the equator. The creationists water canopy is all that can explain why the earth did not overheat at the equator. The bible says there was a water canopy back in the beginning which explains how tropic plants to be thriving at the poles. Whats your explanation for tropical plants thriving in the artic, without a canopy how could the equator not be much hotter, etc...?A water canopy would of shielded the earth making the greenhouse effect to spread out over the entire planet (right?) and interestingly the natural evidence of a tropical climate over the poles only support the inerrancy of the biblical canopy the creationists refer too. They are not twisting the facts from their point of view accelerated decay makes sense. Helium diffusion,etc... What about primordial polonium halo's concentric halo's means the earth cooled within 30 minutes. right? Its evidence the earth didn't cool for billions of years. right?++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++=Polonium Halos in Deep Earth GraniteTraditional science says that earth was formed from molten matter from stars and it was cooled down slowly - overy billions of years.
Then Robert Gentry discovered one of the most intriguing mystery that challenges the traditional theory of the "creation of the earth".Gentry discovered Polonium Halos in granite rocks which CANNOT have formed if the earth cools down over billions of years....There has not been any satisfactory explanation for this discovery, except one: that the earth was formed in a solid form within minutes !!!Gentry reported that he had specifically tested whether the halos were caused by primordial polunium (i.e., starting with Polonium as initial element, in other words: the polonium was NOT a product of radio-active decade).The Implications of Polonium-238 halosSo what the big deal about these Polonium-218 halos ???
Well, it would not be anything special if some other element (like U-238) was originally embedded in the rock when it was formed....But the fact that the ORIGINAL material was Polonium-218 make every difference, because of the decay sequence and the half-time of Polonium-218.Think:To form a Polonium-218 halo, some Polonium-218 must be embedded into the rock BEFORE the rock becomes solidTo form a Polonium-218 halo, the Polonium-218 must be decaying AFTER the rock becomes solidPolonium-218 halo has a half life of 3 minutes, so after 30 minutes, almost all of the Polonium-218 would have disappeared !!!So ???
....The time between the rocks of the earth was molten and that is was solidified is at most 30 minutes !!!!Here in lies the problem for the traditional Big Bang theory - it proposes a hot earth and cooled down VERY SLOWLY - it took BILLIONS of years to cool, not just 30 minutes !!! Study Pages Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

The photon differs from other particles its said it has zero rest mass so how does it change the equation from the inside? other than bring energy into the nucleus and its this energy thats exciting the nucleus thats believed responsible for accelerating decay from the inside of the nucleus. right?It says the energy removed when a alpha particle decays is a gamma ray! right?
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++The photon differs from many other elementary particles, such as the electron and the quark, in that it has zero rest mass;[1] therefore, it travels (in a vacuum) at the speed of light,Photon - WikipediaEdited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

It does not change the number of protons nor neutrons in the center of the nucleus. It does increase the energy in the inside of the nucleus. right?+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++Gamma DecayIn gamma decay, depicted in Fig. 3-6, a nucleus changes from a higher energy state to a lower energy state through the emission of electromagnetic radiation (photons). The number of protons (and neutrons) in the nucleus does not change in this process, so the parent and daughter atoms are the same chemical element. In the gamma decay of a nucleus, the emitted photon and recoiling nucleus each have a well-defined energy after the decay. The characteristic energy is divided between only two particles.Gamma Decay

Polonium Radiohalos: The Model for Their Formation Tested and Verified
by Andrew A. Snelling, Ph.D.One focus of the RATE (Radioisotopes and the Age of The Earth) project was radiohalos research.1 It was concluded that the uranium (238U) and polonium (Po) radiohalos frequently found in granitic rocks had to have formed simultaneously.2 This implies that hundreds of millions of years of radioactive decay (at today's rates) had to have occurred in a matter of a few days!Polonium Radiohalos: The Model for Their Formation Tested and Verified | The Institute for Creation Research

Interestingly they never mentioned photons which affect the nucleur forces inside the atom, etc... They either are uniformitarians or afraid of losing tenure? It takes a creationists to stand up to the status quo! right?With biotite flakes having polonium halo's it does suggest accelerated decay happened during the biblical flood to a creationists! If it can not be radon because of mobility problems over long periods of time then it might well be due to accelerated decay in a water medium to deal with the mobility radon problems. right?--------------------------------------------------------------Andrew Snelling said: At the temperatures of these metamorphic processes such water would become hydrothermal fluids capable of transporting any U-decay products from nearby zircon grains and depositing Po in biotite flakes to form Po radiohalos.The hydrothermal fluid transport model for Po radiohalos formation has thus been tested and verified. Neither the Po nor the biotite flakes were primordial. The biotite flakes were formed in the sandstone only during the metamorphism early in the Flood year, and the Po was derived from 238U decay in the zircon grains. And where extra water was generated during the metamorphic processes, many more Po radiohalos were formed. This successful verification only serves to spur on continuing research, because the time scale implications for the formation of the Po radiohalos and these metamorphic rocks are only consistent with a global Flood on a young earthPolonium Radiohalos: The Model for Their Formation Tested and Verified | The Institute for Creation Research To produce the amount of polonium halo's Snelling is talking about thats not primordial polonium would require 238 U to decay so rapidly that Snellings suggesting its like evidence of 100's of millions of years of decay happening in just the one year of the biblical world flood.--------------------------------------------------------------There needs to have been that much decay of 238U to produce both the visible physical damage (the radiohalos) and the required Po, but that much Po would then have decayed within a few days (because of its short half-lives, that is, very rapid decay rates). So radioisotope "ages" for such granitic rocks of hundreds of millions of years, calculated on the assumption that radioactive decay has always occurred at today's rates, are grossly in error, and these rocks would thus have formed during the Flood year only 4500 years ago. A hydrothermal fluid (hot water) transport model was thus proposed which explained how the Po was separated from its parent 238U and then concentrated in radiocenters close by to form the Po radiohalos.3-5Polonium Radiohalos: The Model for Their Formation Tested and Verified | The Institute for Creation ResearchThe primordial polonium halos are pictures of the past showing radon gas is too mobile to of parented these perfectly focused polonium halo's. Its evidence the earth had to of cooled within 30 minutes or the polonium would of decayed before the granites formed. The granite can not form and go thru the decay chain to polonium 218 due radon gas is mobile meaning the halos Gentry is talking about would of been smudged because radon gas is not bound to one location.Primordial Polonium however is bound to one location and because no evidence it decayed from radon means its primordial having no decay parent and without a parent the earth had to of cooled within 30 minutes. right? Radon is just too mobile to produce halo's because radon is not positively grounded. right?-------------------------------------------------------------------Then Radon decades to Po-218; and voila - Polonium halos...This explanation has a lot of holes:If the Radon did gather to a single "positively charged" location and did decade into Po-218; the alpha particle emitted by Radon-222 (when it decades to Po-218) would have form an extra ring in the halos
Some articles did report a "fussy" radon ring in the sharply visible Polonium halos - but they did not reason further, so let me do that here: if the radon ring is "fussy", the most likely cause is: random location of decaying radon atoms. The result of this is randomly situated Polonium-218 atoms. The consequence of this is: a undetectable smear instead of sharply visible concentrated Polonium halos. (The discoloration will only happen by billions of Po-218 decades concentrated in a single spot - without high concentration, it will be a undetectable smear).Although Rason-222 is initially negatively charged (because Radiun-226 emitted 2 positive protons away when it decaded into Radon-222), the Radon-222 will lose the extra (2) electrons when it collides with other molecules. Especially if the negatively charged Radon-222 is "directed towards a positively charged" location - Radon-222 will shet its electrons. After shedding the excess electrons, the radon gas is neutral and diffusion will make the radon gas go in every possble direction and will not "gather" at a negatively charged spot.
Bottomline: radon gas will not accummulate in a single spot - and without high concentration of Po-218 in a single spot, you don't get halos (the discoloration will only happen by billions of Po-218 decades concentrated in a single spot - without high concentration, it will be a undetectable smear) Study Pages
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If accelerated decay is caused by the photon with the genesis canopy crashing down on the earth would of had thousands of years of photon absorbtion. right? However water absorbs heat and creates water vapor which rises and returns as rain. Ice vaporizes in the vacuum of space above the atmosphere and water and steam too vaporizes in a vaccum so heat escapes to space. The heat problem solved. right?
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If you have a pocket of radon gas it has to be spot on. right? A pocket of mobile gases can never be right on in a crack and close only gets you a smudged image of polonium. right? If its not close to the previous polonium image it gives no image until the image is reinforced by previous alphas that that decayed from a positively grounded location in the center of the halo. Is not this why Gentry point of primordial valid? and why you don't see radon halo's? If this is in fact the case then its evidence toward young earthdom! You mean your sources well all it appears they can do is but provide misinformation that radon could be center of halos the instant polonium decays which is of course baloney! right? If not in the exact center over time the halo would be smudged? Gentry has asked the Academy of Sciences to refute these points that they have not in over 15 years and all you have is radon gas might well be the people lying are those misrepresenting radon and long periods of time because the only alternative is the truth that its an "Young Earth". right?Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

akjv genesis 1:7 The open firmament is the area just below the water above and above the waters below. akjv 1:20 the open firmament is the area the fowl flew. Likely water ionizes and due the magnetic field as well in space there is a vacuum and even ice vaporizes not just water in a vacuum such as exists above the atmosphere. It would not block photons but absorb photons. Presently the atmosphere today shields us from gamma radiations photons. right? Why not? heat rises but agree this water canopy before it came crashing down would of tended to trap heat much like a greenhouse slowing the escape of heat to space. Which is why you have tropical plant fossils showing they thrived under the north pole thousands not millions of years ago. Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.

Because Titan’s atmosphere is almost entirely nitrogen, scientists anticipated they would find an abundance of nitrogen ions scattered throughout Saturn’s magnetosphere. That, in fact, is not the case; nitrogen ions are found to be comparatively rare. Instead, the magnetosphere is dominated by plasma composed almost entirely of ionized water and water products, including O+, OH+, H2O+ and H3O+. The source of the water group ions is now seen to be almost entirely coming from the venting of Enceladus. One unusual aspect of the relative abundances of the water group ions is that they are similar to those found in cometary comas observed near 1 astronomical unit (1 AU equals the distance from Earth to the sun). Most of the ionization near 1 AU comes from solar ultraviolet (UV) photons, whereas at Saturn, located at 9.5 AU, the source of ionization has to be the rotating plasma itself, not solar UV. Why the two very different source situations produce similar results is under investigation.Newsroom | Southwest Research InstituteNote: In respect to the ionization near 1AU the distance from the sun to the earth comes from solar ultraviolet (UV) photons. Is not that interesting in respect to the possiblility of photons ability to be absorbed into the nucleus and the suns photons being shielded by the atmosphere. Is the photons being absorbed by the water molecules electron shield or inside the nuleus to form these various ionizations? Like the flood the rate boys believe in the water canopy. right? So photons charging the waters of the canopy would it transfer photons to the sediments on the surface of the earth under water pressure be causing an rapid accelerating of decay rates? Whatever appears polonium not primordial appears Andrew Snelling is onto something that his discovery of polonium halo's is evidence of accelerating decay did in fact happen during the biblical flood. right? He has evidence accelerated decay happened but apparently not how it happened. right?Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.Edited by johnfolton, : No reason given.