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Author Topic:   Safety and Effectiveness of Herbs and Pharmaceuticals
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 161 of 209 (555484)
04-13-2010 10:54 PM
Reply to: Message 159 by Theodoric
04-13-2010 5:31 PM


Re: FDA - Cancer Research
Any evidence that holistic treatment for cancer works? Or just anecdotal evidence?
The evidence is people who were given up as terminal by conventional MDs still walking around alive and functioning.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by Theodoric, posted 04-13-2010 5:31 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by anglagard, posted 04-14-2010 12:39 AM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 163 by Theodoric, posted 04-14-2010 8:22 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 170 by Taq, posted 04-14-2010 9:42 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 164 of 209 (555569)
04-14-2010 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 162 by anglagard
04-14-2010 12:39 AM


Re: Not the Question
anglagard writes:
Do you have any evidence other than personal testimony, which not only covers an insignificant percentage of the total amount of individuals using holistic treatments, but is also limited to survivors.
Would the world renouned Scripts Clinic and other scientifically astute institutions integrate holistic regimes into their healthcare methodologies if they were not scientifically evidenced?
Edited by Buzsaw, : clarify wording

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 162 by anglagard, posted 04-14-2010 12:39 AM anglagard has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 165 by Theodoric, posted 04-14-2010 9:03 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 166 by Percy, posted 04-14-2010 9:10 AM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 167 by Apothecus, posted 04-14-2010 9:27 AM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 169 by Taq, posted 04-14-2010 9:40 AM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 174 of 209 (555593)
04-14-2010 10:53 AM
Reply to: Message 167 by Apothecus
04-14-2010 9:27 AM


Re: Not the Question
Apothecus writes:
Adjunct to this (it almost seems it's added as a tiny postscript) are various "holistic" therapies, such as healing touch, stress therapy, massage, acupuncture, and the like. I don't think anyone is claiming these types of therapies are useless, Buz. If they can provide a measure of mental or physical well being pursuant to some medically and scientifically proven procedure, then great!
You're oversimplifying, Apothecus, without citing the nutritional elements of the Scripts regimes. They have enough scientific sense to use the best of everything, as does Dr. Whitaker's Wellness Clenic where he integrates with 5 other MDs under him.
I've cited a number of universities etc as well which integrate the holistic methologies. You people simply wave off this evidence that holistic is scientific. If it weren't, these higly reputable institutions would not implement them. Simple as that.
I've been talking integrating all along, yet you and others here falsely imply that I reject things like implants and other wonderful features of integrated methodology. Way back in this thread, I was talking integrateion. Injury cannot be patched up by holistic diet alone, but integrating holistic diet etc with surgery, etc makes for quicker and better recovery, for example.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist or a peer reviewed study for evidence that good oil and gasoline make the auto run efficiently. Neither does it take a clinical study to know that celentro, fresh pressed carrot juice, garlic and such are more conducive to remaining cancer free or healing than Pesi, salty potatoe chips and nitrited processed hot dogs.
Treating systemically, the whole body (holistic) logically makes more sense than spending millions, millions and ever more millions over the decades searching, searching, and researching for the magic silver bullet symptomatic breast cancer cure, enriching the researchers while the silver bullet cure awaits discovery. The holistically recoveries rarely if ever hit the news as evidence, but every thread of hope for the silver bullet pill gets extensively aired and reviewed. Over and over we hear these announcements aired, so the sheeples keep on keeping on shelling out, running marathons and donating to drives for cancer research.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 167 by Apothecus, posted 04-14-2010 9:27 AM Apothecus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 175 by Percy, posted 04-14-2010 11:46 AM Buzsaw has seen this message but not replied
 Message 176 by Taq, posted 04-14-2010 12:26 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 178 by Apothecus, posted 04-14-2010 2:12 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 185 of 209 (556243)
04-18-2010 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 178 by Apothecus
04-14-2010 2:12 PM


Re: Not the Question
Apothecus writes:
As they say, "it don't make no nevermind" to my position on the whole, Buz. My point is that all of these "alternative" therapies may, from either "mind over matter" effects on mental and/or emotional well being or possible actual physical effects, exert some benefit. I say this while openly describing some of them (I said some, Buz) as hoo-haw at best.
It's great that you support integrated therapy, Buz. But when you make statements like this in response to Coragyp's post:
Buz writes:
No alternative suppliments are a silver bullet for cancer. Going at it naturally would require a very stringent and well guided regimen. Also, it depends on how advanced the cancer was before beginning any program. There comes a point where nothing outside of a miracle will be able to bring remission or cure.
... it makes me think you would never support mainstream therapies for any situation as primary treatment. I'm talking chemotherapy, Buz. I know, it's probably anathema to you to consider this, but what if it were your wife and the physician stated it was either chemo or 3 months? Would you resort to prayer and woo? Or would you truthfully, as you state, support therapy integrated with mainstream and alternative therapies, as I'd support? I'm just wondering, because quite frankly, your statements are confusing and somewhat contradictory.
Hi Apothecus. Thanks for sharing that you're undergoing chemotherapy. Yesterday at church I requested prayer on your behalf and we prayed for you. No matter what course of action you have taken, nothing is impossible with God, if in his providence he chooses to heal you miraculously. We pray for your recovery as prayer has been sent up for our cyber-friend, RAZD, who also underwent these treatments. Thank God, he's still with us.
As to whether I'd support chemo, it is my understanding that the integrated Wellness Clinic in Ventura, Ca, the largest of it's kind in the US, where MD Dr. Julian Whitaker and his five colleague MDs under him apply some chemo in certain cases to their mainly wholistic health regimes which they advocate.
The wholistic approach is to build up the immune system so as to overcome the cancer cells rather than to destroy it, killing both good and bad cells. No matter which way one chooses to go, I would suppose that neither would be very effective if undertaken in a halfhearted lacadaisical manner.
Perhaps for you, once the chemo is completed, then is the time to rebuild your impaired immune systems via a vigorous wholeistic health regime, applying the necessary nutrients the body's systems need to keep the cancer cells at bay.
Certainly, regardless of what you do, the more knowledge you acqure relative to all aspects of health, the less you will be in the dark as to what where to go from here.
May your life be prolonged and your future bright. Go with God and the principles set forth in his book.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 178 by Apothecus, posted 04-14-2010 2:12 PM Apothecus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by onifre, posted 04-18-2010 6:12 PM Buzsaw has seen this message but not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 189 of 209 (556328)
04-19-2010 8:26 AM
Reply to: Message 187 by Apothecus
04-18-2010 6:52 PM


Re: Not the Question
Apothecus writes:
Have a good one, and thanks again for the prayers. Maybe god'll let me save them for a later unfortunate turn in life.
My apologies for missapplying you to the sick list, Bud. I see I need to brush up on reading and comprehension skills.
Anyhow, now that you're near the top of my prayer list, I'll just keep you there a spell. God knows whatever other needs you may have. Perhaps there's a need of understanding relative to the Biblical scriptures your personal salvation, a financial or other special need that we could re-apply the prayers to. I'll just make it apply to God (Jehovah, the Biblical god, that is) effecting in your life whatever is best for you and yours.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 187 by Apothecus, posted 04-18-2010 6:52 PM Apothecus has seen this message but not replied

  
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