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Author Topic:   Separation of church and state
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 144 of 313 (576489)
08-24-2010 9:46 AM
Reply to: Message 139 by sac51495
08-23-2010 10:33 PM


The Constitution was the result of the effort to make sure that religion did not gain political power.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by sac51495, posted 08-23-2010 10:33 PM sac51495 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by sac51495, posted 08-24-2010 9:58 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 147 of 313 (576647)
08-24-2010 10:14 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by sac51495
08-24-2010 9:58 PM


Re: No religion?
I have studied the history. In addition the founding fathers knew history and knew that religion and politics would mean that there would be no union.
These were people intimately familiar with how dangerous and disruptive religion, particularly Christianity was. They were familiar with what happened under Henry and Edward and Mary and Elizabeth and James I & VI. They were very aware of the Wars of Religion that disrupted much of Europe, and of the Thirty Years War.
They knew that Maryland and Pennsylvania and Virginia and Georgia and North and South Carolina and New York and New Jersey and Delaware and Connecticut feared the New England Puritans gaining power.
They understood that to create a Union the government, politics, needed to be protected from religion and that religion needed to be protected from the government.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 158 of 313 (576825)
08-25-2010 7:38 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by marc9000
08-25-2010 7:13 PM


You do realize that the only mention of "Humanism" in TORCASO V. WATKINS, 367 U. S. 488 (1961) is a mention in one of the footnotes. Also TORCASO V. WATKINS, 367 U. S. 488 (1961) has NOTHING to do with anything except the Establishment Clause and says that states cannot require someone declare a belief in God.
Your linkie is nothing but nutjob rantings, misrepresentation and innuendo.
BUT, even then it is irrelevant.
The fact is that all that was involved in that case was the attempt by the state of Maryland to make a specific belief a test of whether or not someone could hold a political job.
It is one of the better Supreme Court Decisions when it comes to preserving religious rights.
It also has NOTHING to do with the origin of separation of church and state.
Edited by jar, : appalin spallin

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 177 of 313 (577135)
08-27-2010 9:54 AM
Reply to: Message 176 by PaulK
08-27-2010 2:45 AM


PaulK writes:
marc9000 writes:
That link referenced Dr Sidney Simon. Do you not believe he exists? Do you not believe he made this statement;
quote:
I always bootlegged the values stuff under other titles. I was assigned to teach Social Studies in the elementary school, and I taught Values Clarification."
And that's the best you can drag out of it ? That's your evidence of an organised Soviet-style "campaign against religion" ? One guy includes some unspecified values in his classes ? That's not even enough to demonstrate any wrongdoing on the part of Simon. It certainly doesn't demonstrate an organised government campaign against religion !
And note the guy is talking about Elementary School.
Sheesh.
Values Clarification (whatever that is) at an Elementary School level, and that is his case?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 183 of 313 (577564)
08-29-2010 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 181 by marc9000
08-29-2010 4:05 PM


Re: Time machine?
Do you not understand that many of us actually read the posts in the thread and so know what was said in that message?
No where in that message does Dr A say or imply he was unaware of Emerson. What that message addressed was your misrepresentation that "A few decades after he said that, in 1947, an activist US Supreme Court, packed by FDR during the 1930’s, separated church and state for the first time in the US."
He was pointing out that Reynolds in 1878 affirmed the concept of separation of church and state.
While we are pointing out your misrepresentations, I feel it's necessary to point out that FDR did not "pack the Supreme Court". In fact the "Judiciary Reorganization Bill of 1937" never even made it through the voting process and died in committee.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by marc9000, posted 08-29-2010 4:36 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 188 of 313 (577570)
08-29-2010 4:43 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by marc9000
08-29-2010 4:36 PM


Re: Time machine?
I have. And I also read it in context and did not simply quotemine.
He is talking about your factually incorrect assertions which he quoted in his response.
I will try to reinforce what he said.
When you claim "A few decades after he said that, in 1947, an activist US Supreme Court, packed by FDR during the 1930’s, separated church and state for the first time in the US." you are wrong at least two way.
FDR did not pack the Supreme Court and the Supreme Court did not affirm separation of church and state for the first time in 1947.
You are simply wrong and continue to post falsehoods.
It's time for you to learn how to learn.
Edited by jar, : forgot to include the date

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 200 of 313 (579685)
09-05-2010 4:20 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by crashfrog
09-05-2010 4:11 PM


We have already discussed Torcaso v. Watkins with him, obviously without effect, plus there is also Cecil Bothwell in Asheville, NC.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 224 of 313 (580739)
09-10-2010 9:37 PM
Reply to: Message 222 by marc9000
09-10-2010 9:28 PM


marc9000 writes:
The US foundings represent a fear of "domestic faction and insurrection". Federalist #10 Global warming and atheistic teachings in public schools fall into that category amazingly well.
Huh?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 231 of 313 (580748)
09-10-2010 10:03 PM
Reply to: Message 230 by Theodoric
09-10-2010 9:59 PM


Nebraska only has the cases going back to 1991 in Pacer.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 230 by Theodoric, posted 09-10-2010 9:59 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 232 by Theodoric, posted 09-10-2010 10:10 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 234 of 313 (580755)
09-10-2010 10:25 PM
Reply to: Message 232 by Theodoric
09-10-2010 10:10 PM


Re: again marc9000 has no evidence
I imagine that it exists. The question is whether it actually says what they claim it says.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 243 of 313 (580849)
09-11-2010 5:45 PM
Reply to: Message 242 by Coragyps
09-11-2010 5:31 PM


Re: Know what you are talking about
Still cringe when I remember the day I had to recite the NEW Pledge of Allegiance and I was concentrating so hard on getting the new phrase in that I messed up all the rest. Oh the shame of it all. And Suzy was sitting in the very front row and she giggled and laughed and pointed at me.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 242 by Coragyps, posted 09-11-2010 5:31 PM Coragyps has replied

Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 282 of 313 (583535)
09-27-2010 8:50 PM
Reply to: Message 281 by subbie
09-27-2010 8:46 PM


Re: Evidence, please
Subbie writes:
marc9000 writes:
And I accept the ICR's interpretation far more than Provine's, Dawkin's or Stenger's.
For purposes of this discussion, I'm not willing to accept anyone's "interpretation." I want to see what the book says.
And that is the heart of the discussion. Marc seems to be part of the crowd that accept SOURCE over CONTENT.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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jar
Member (Idle past 424 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 288 of 313 (584613)
10-02-2010 10:16 PM
Reply to: Message 286 by marc9000
10-02-2010 10:10 PM


Re: No True Scotsmen fallacy again?
A few years ago I read his book Finding Darwin’s God — A Scientist’s Search For Common Ground Between God And Evolution, and found it to be about 90% Darwin and 10% God.
It has already been pointed out to you that there is no conflict between Evolution or the Theory of Evolution and Christianity.
If YOUR chapter of Club Christian has a problem with either then YOUR chapter of Club Christian is free to continue to deliberately embrace scientific ignorance and transmit such ignorance to YOUR children.
BUT...do not presume to speak for either GOD or Christianity.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
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