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Author Topic:   Nature's innate intelligence. Does it exist?
Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 188 of 303 (638649)
10-24-2011 12:52 PM
Reply to: Message 182 by zi ko
10-23-2011 2:39 PM


Percy, you know i am proposing a new hypothesis about evolution.
You have not presented an hypothesis. You have presented a belief. When you understand the difference between the two you will understand the mistakes you have made in this thread.
Is it strange to you that i have no evidence in relation to this hypothesis?
The problem is that you have no way of testing the hypothesis. Hypotheses need to be testable.

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Taq
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Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 191 of 303 (638787)
10-25-2011 7:37 PM
Reply to: Message 189 by shadow71
10-25-2011 5:09 PM


Re: what stored intelligence?
Here is the web cite of Peter Swain. He seem to disagree with you and it appears Ziko's OP is very close to this scientists research in re cells and decision making.
This isn't a suggested reading forum. This is a discussion forum. This means you need to make your own arguments. It is ok to cite work done by others, but you need to summarize their findings in your own words and be willing to defend those arguments with your own words. Thus far, you don't seem willing to do this.
Of course, I am not an admin so take this as a suggestion from a fellow poster.

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 237 of 303 (639196)
10-28-2011 5:12 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by shadow71
10-26-2011 7:05 PM


Re: Wow!!
Are you assuming that Peter Swain is a complete idiot?
Are you saying that he is right? If so, demonstrate why he is right by citing evidence.
Arguments from authority are useless. Cite evidence.

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 238 of 303 (639197)
10-28-2011 5:15 PM
Reply to: Message 212 by zi ko
10-27-2011 10:09 AM


Re: innate intelligence
Don't you think decision making and information processing are intelligent acts (according to my own definition of intelligence)?
According to your definition of intelligence, a rock is intelligent because it decides to fall. A cloud is intelligent because it processes surrounding information to produce huricanes. By your definition, EVERYTHING is intelligent.

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 Message 212 by zi ko, posted 10-27-2011 10:09 AM zi ko has replied

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 268 of 303 (639856)
11-04-2011 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 267 by shadow71
11-04-2011 1:04 PM


Re: Probabilistic to planned, how did you get there?
The important part is that there appears to be learning involved in the process.
This process is quite different to how humans learn. Obviously, we are talking about different decision making processes. While some scientists may borrow terms from other areas, they are quite clearly using a different definition.
The process that they are talking about is the inheritance of set responses to set stimuli. Set responses that increase fitness are spread through the population at a higher rate than set responses that do not increase fitness or lower fitness. This is a non-intelligent process.
This is no different than water using its engrained intelligence to sort particles by density and size. If you take a mixture of sand, dirt, and gravel and mix it with a large volume of water you will find that the largest and most dense particles will sort to the bottom with the smallest and least dense particles on top. The water uses a decision making process to produce this pattern in the same way that an individual cell uses a decision making process to produce a set response to a set stimuli.

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 291 of 303 (640309)
11-08-2011 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 288 by zi ko
11-07-2011 1:00 PM


Re: innate intelligence
But try to understand this. A man practically living alone with only his PC, poor knowledge of english languadge, no previous studies on the matter, not any kind of help or guidance, trying to formulate a comprehensive new theory of evolution , anew paradigm of it. It is really insane. BUT I HAD TO GET IT KNOWN.
What you have just admitted is that you are a crackpot. A somewhat endearing crackpot, but a crackpot nonetheless.
What I would suggest is that you learn about Darwin's life history. He didn't write Origins on a whim. He spent years studying as a naturalist before he even felt comfortable writing that book. If it were not for Alfred Russel Wallace he probably would have waited another few decades before publishing. The difference between you (the crackpot) and a scientist is that scientists work hard to support their ideas before publishing them.
I want to believe it will be proved, at least in some aspects, right.
This belief seems to be very weak. This belief does not even compel you to construct a testable model. You don't even feel it necessary to learn the fundamentals of genetics and molecular biology. If this belief does not even compel you to put forth a minimum amount of effort to show that it has promise, why should other scientists feel compelled to check it out?
Edited by Admin, : Fix quote.

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 Message 288 by zi ko, posted 11-07-2011 1:00 PM zi ko has replied

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Taq
Member
Posts: 10085
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.6


Message 300 of 303 (640451)
11-09-2011 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 296 by zi ko
11-09-2011 10:06 AM


Re: innate intelligence
Also science does not advances by someone who feels safe under the knowledge of others and not being able to offer or discuss a single new idea, or even worse he is afraid of any such idea.
The falsification of a long standing theory is one of the most exciting things I can think of. You are wrong. We are not protecting a tightly held belief. We are protecting reason and logic, something which you cast aside on a regular basis. We would absolutely love it if you could actually challenge modern theories with something that resembles evidence, reason, and logic. Sadly, you lack all three.

This message is a reply to:
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